gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 27, 2021 12:46:39 GMT
The Cold War in 1984 looked like this. Having a zombie apocalypse in this era would be interesting. I wonder if the Soviets and NATO get into an alliance against the walking dead. 
I'm assuming that the crosses relate to areas where there is widespread either civil unrest or terrorism? With the green in Ulster and Israel being related to not directly politically orientated while red and blue are areas where communist and anti-communist factors are prominent.
Suspect a lot would depend on the circumstances. If it was in a core region of either side - say the US or western Europe for the west or Russia for the communist bloc - then the other side would probably be quietly smug at 1st unless and until the pandemic got really serious. Some of the more extreme elements might seek ways to 'help' make things worse for their opponents.
Steve
Red cross stands for communist insurgency, blue cross stands for anti-community insurgency, and green cross stands for separatist insurgency. This is from Wikipedia and I couldn't find any better Cold War situation in 1984 map. The U.S. and the West being more open would mean the public knows but would also panic. I'm more interested what U.S. forces overseas such as those in Britain, Germany, Italy, Japan, South Korea, and the Philippines react to a zombie outbreak in the U.S. If it is indeed global, I doubt the U.S. won't withdraw soldiers from Europe or Asia that quickly. Number one, withdrawals of a massive size isn't orderly. And number 2, that would leave Europe vulnerable to any possible Soviet incursions. North Korea may get ideas of reigniting the Korean War. Secondly, I'm sure communist countries would censor the news of the outbreak in the U.S. For one, they would say its the failure of the capitalist system. Two, regimes like USSR or China may try to cover-up outbreaks like in World War Z. Those attempting to be a whistleblower would be arrested by the KGB or the MSS for "trying to spread rumors." The advantage of the USSR is that Siberia is sparsely-populated so the CPSU could evacuate there. They also have a large army with a big fleet of tanks and armored vehicles. The same could be said for China. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jan 27, 2021 13:49:45 GMT
I'm assuming that the crosses relate to areas where there is widespread either civil unrest or terrorism? With the green in Ulster and Israel being related to not directly politically orientated while red and blue are areas where communist and anti-communist factors are prominent.
Suspect a lot would depend on the circumstances. If it was in a core region of either side - say the US or western Europe for the west or Russia for the communist bloc - then the other side would probably be quietly smug at 1st unless and until the pandemic got really serious. Some of the more extreme elements might seek ways to 'help' make things worse for their opponents.
Steve
Red cross stands for communist insurgency, blue cross stands for anti-community insurgency, and green cross stands for separatist insurgency. This is from Wikipedia and I couldn't find any better Cold War situation in 1984 map. The U.S. and the West being more open would mean the public knows but would also panic. I'm more interested what U.S. forces overseas such as those in Britain, Germany, Italy, Japan, South Korea, and the Philippines react to a zombie outbreak in the U.S. If it is indeed global, I doubt the U.S. won't withdraw soldiers from Europe or Asia that quickly. Number one, withdrawals of a massive size isn't orderly. And number 2, that would leave Europe vulnerable to any possible Soviet incursions. North Korea may get ideas of reigniting the Korean War. Secondly, I'm sure communist countries would censor the news of the outbreak in the U.S. For one, they would say its the failure of the capitalist system. Two, regimes like USSR or China may try to cover-up outbreaks like in World War Z. Those attempting to be a whistleblower would be arrested by the KGB or the MSS for "trying to spread rumors." The advantage of the USSR is that Siberia is sparsely-populated so the CPSU could evacuate there. They also have a large army with a big fleet of tanks and armored vehicles. The same could be said for China.
Good point about censorship in the communist powers. That would be almost certain given their government type and desire to avoid showing any weakness. That could well see it getting very bad before the authorities admit both the problem and that it's now out of control. This could be very nasty in a heavily populated region such as eastern China as even the masses of armed troops the CCP could assemble could be overwhelmed. Also there might be the problem of people being reluctant to shoot relatives/friends they recognise among the infected, until its too late in some cases.
I suspect that Siberia might be more of a problem than European Russia for the Soviets. Its so vast and thinly populated that, assuming standard zombies that don't need food and are immune to many things such as cold could mean its pretty much impossible to clear of zombies. Which means possibly isolated groups causing problems for decades to come, making it even more unwelcoming for any resettlement of the area. [European Russia is also so thinly populated in many areas that this could be an issue, especially in the northern and eastern parts. However near the cities and in the flatter southern regions the population density is enough that if the pandemic is brought under some level of control those areas would be more secure for habitation than less populated ones]. The same sort of problem would occur in many thinly settled and/or rugged parts of the world including much of the US west for instance, the Sahara region or areas around the main mountain chains.
As such once the governments and populations have enough knowledge of what the problem actually is the more settled and technologically developed parts of the world are likely to do a lot better because they have the resources to destroy zombies in large numbers and have the firepower and ability to build defences to keep people safer against roaming zombies, whether in large or small numbers. [Assuming here the more classic slow shambling zombie but possibly also applies to a lesser effect against a more rapidly moving enemy].
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 27, 2021 14:32:32 GMT
Red cross stands for communist insurgency, blue cross stands for anti-community insurgency, and green cross stands for separatist insurgency. This is from Wikipedia and I couldn't find any better Cold War situation in 1984 map. The U.S. and the West being more open would mean the public knows but would also panic. I'm more interested what U.S. forces overseas such as those in Britain, Germany, Italy, Japan, South Korea, and the Philippines react to a zombie outbreak in the U.S. If it is indeed global, I doubt the U.S. won't withdraw soldiers from Europe or Asia that quickly. Number one, withdrawals of a massive size isn't orderly. And number 2, that would leave Europe vulnerable to any possible Soviet incursions. North Korea may get ideas of reigniting the Korean War. Secondly, I'm sure communist countries would censor the news of the outbreak in the U.S. For one, they would say its the failure of the capitalist system. Two, regimes like USSR or China may try to cover-up outbreaks like in World War Z. Those attempting to be a whistleblower would be arrested by the KGB or the MSS for "trying to spread rumors." The advantage of the USSR is that Siberia is sparsely-populated so the CPSU could evacuate there. They also have a large army with a big fleet of tanks and armored vehicles. The same could be said for China.
Good point about censorship in the communist powers. That would be almost certain given their government type and desire to avoid showing any weakness. That could well see it getting very bad before the authorities admit both the problem and that it's now out of control. This could be very nasty in a heavily populated region such as eastern China as even the masses of armed troops the CCP could assemble could be overwhelmed. Also there might be the problem of people being reluctant to shoot relatives/friends they recognise among the infected, until its too late in some cases.
I suspect that Siberia might be more of a problem than European Russia for the Soviets. Its so vast and thinly populated that, assuming standard zombies that don't need food and are immune to many things such as cold could mean its pretty much impossible to clear of zombies. Which means possibly isolated groups causing problems for decades to come, making it even more unwelcoming for any resettlement of the area. [European Russia is also so thinly populated in many areas that this could be an issue, especially in the northern and eastern parts. However near the cities and in the flatter southern regions the population density is enough that if the pandemic is brought under some level of control those areas would be more secure for habitation than less populated ones]. The same sort of problem would occur in many thinly settled and/or rugged parts of the world including much of the US west for instance, the Sahara region or areas around the main mountain chains.
As such once the governments and populations have enough knowledge of what the problem actually is the more settled and technologically developed parts of the world are likely to do a lot better because they have the resources to destroy zombies in large numbers and have the firepower and ability to build defences to keep people safer against roaming zombies, whether in large or small numbers. [Assuming here the more classic slow shambling zombie but possibly also applies to a lesser effect against a more rapidly moving enemy].
Consider this is 1984, the part China was the most liberal and free. The cover ups will be there and it would be marked as a "crackdown on dissidents" just like the Cultural Revolution on twenty years prior. The good thing about the PLA is that since the 1960s, they were prepared to fight a big war against the Soviet Union and by extent the United States until Nixon, so they have lots of guns, ammo, artillery, obsolete tanks, and planes in storage for such. If things get desperate, I wonder how long until the Second Artillery Corps begins using nuclear weapons on cities in the East. These are the slow Romero zombies that do rot and get affected by weather. Not only that, animals attack them either way. The cold climate of Siberia would freeze them. Perhaps what the Soviet Armed Forces and by extension their Warsaw Pact allies will do is to wait for General Winter for the zombies to freeze. The USSR also has the same situation as China: massive reserves, lots of WWII and early Cold War guns, tanks, and planes in storage, and a large nuclear arsenal. It was given in the Romero universe once a bullet to the head and burning the corpse was the best way to dispose of them, then it would be very easy by then. The slow shambling zombies would fall prey to superior firepower and massive air support. The U.S., their NATO allies, and the Soviets don't even really need to deploy tanks. Light utility vehicles such as technicals, Humvees, Jeeps, and UAZs would do the bidding. Tanks (M1 Abrams, Leopard 1, Leopard 2, Challenger 1, T-80, T-72, Type 69) and armored personnel carriers (M113, Bradley IFV, BMP, and BTR) would be useful on taking on hordes. Dr. Logan did point it out that "shooting them in the head" would have been better to be done in the beginning when the humans still outnumbered the zombies. Of course, this is a zombie movie and we can't have a character development without the zombies overrunning the humans.  |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 29, 2021 12:17:41 GMT
Since one of the articles here states that cruise liners carrying refugees to Cuba probably means that the U.S. and Cuba probably reach an agreement to house refugees. It would be a reverse 1980 boat lift. I'm sure the Cubans would hold out well, considering the country has been preparing for war with the United States since the 1960s. The implications of a truce would be interesting. Or probably these ships are headed to Gitmo.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 29, 2021 12:19:48 GMT
Since one of the articles here states that cruise liners carrying refugees to Cuba probably means that the U.S. and Cuba probably reach an agreement to house refugees. It would be a reverse 1980 boat lift. I'm sure the Cubans would hold out well, considering the country has been preparing for war with the United States since the 1960s. The implications of a truce would be interesting. Or probably these ships are headed to Gitmo. In many instances i have seen cruise liners transporting people in a zombie Apocalypse/deadly virus outbreak in movies, books ore series, there is always a person infected onboard. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 29, 2021 12:23:19 GMT
Since one of the articles here states that cruise liners carrying refugees to Cuba probably means that the U.S. and Cuba probably reach an agreement to house refugees. It would be a reverse 1980 boat lift. I'm sure the Cubans would hold out well, considering the country has been preparing for war with the United States since the 1960s. The implications of a truce would be interesting. Or probably these ships are headed to Gitmo. In many instances i have seen cruise liners transporting people in a zombie Apocalypse/deadly virus outbreak in movies, books ore series, there is always a person infected onboard. Since this takes place in the Romero universe, anyone that dies of non-zombie related deaths such as heart attack will also reanimate and bite several others. I wonder how long the Cubans could hold out, considering that they rely on the USSR for supplies. Best bet for Cuba to survive is to screen all refugees and kill those with bites or other non-treatable diseases. The tropical climate would ensure that the zombies rot faster. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 29, 2021 12:29:26 GMT
In many instances i have seen cruise liners transporting people in a zombie Apocalypse/deadly virus outbreak in movies, books ore series, there is always a person infected onboard. Since this takes place in the Romero universe, anyone that dies of non-zombie related deaths such as heart attack will also reanimate and bite several others. I wonder how long the Cubans could hold out, considering that they rely on the USSR for supplies. Best bet for Cuba to survive is to screen all refugees and kill those with bites or other non-treatable diseases. The tropical climate would ensure that the zombies rot faster. So that is the issues, if i would be a smart Cuban government i would sink any ship that tried to get close to Cuba, even if this might cause a not positive responds to the United States who might see this as a hostile act. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 29, 2021 12:39:18 GMT
Since this takes place in the Romero universe, anyone that dies of non-zombie related deaths such as heart attack will also reanimate and bite several others. I wonder how long the Cubans could hold out, considering that they rely on the USSR for supplies. Best bet for Cuba to survive is to screen all refugees and kill those with bites or other non-treatable diseases. The tropical climate would ensure that the zombies rot faster. So that is the issues, if i would be a smart Cuban government i would sink any ship that tried to get close to Cuba, even if this might cause a not positive responds to the United States who might see this as a hostile act. The part where the Cubans sink refugee boats was utilized in the original script of Resident Evil: Extinction (then-called Afterlife) for the opening scene, but was ultimately scrapped during the second draft. Yes, the U.S. would have retaliated while those at Gitmo would hold a defensive war against the Cubans. However, fighting a war in a middle of a zombie apocalypse is not the smartest thing to do. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 29, 2021 12:42:59 GMT
for the opening scene, but was ultimately scrapped during the second draft. Yes, the U.S. would have retaliated while those at Gitmo would hold a defensive war against the Cubans. However, fighting a war in a middle of a zombie apocalypse is not the smartest thing to do. And in several books, series and other publications i seen that happen where countries go to war with each other regardless if there is a zombie apocalypse going on, example being North Korea versus South Korea and India versus Pakistan. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 29, 2021 14:47:14 GMT
for the opening scene, but was ultimately scrapped during the second draft. Yes, the U.S. would have retaliated while those at Gitmo would hold a defensive war against the Cubans. However, fighting a war in a middle of a zombie apocalypse is not the smartest thing to do. And in several books, series and other publications i seen that happen where countries go to war with each other regardless if there is a zombie apocalypse going on, example being North Korea versus South Korea and India versus Pakistan. A 1980s Korean War or Indo-Pakistani War with a zombie apocalypse would be interesting. Here in the Philippines, since it's 1984, I'm guessing the Marcos dictatorship would do crackdowns against those sheltering the zombies. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jan 30, 2021 11:53:43 GMT
So that is the issues, if i would be a smart Cuban government i would sink any ship that tried to get close to Cuba, even if this might cause a not positive responds to the United States who might see this as a hostile act. The part where the Cubans sink refugee boats was utilized in the original script of Resident Evil: Extinction (then-called Afterlife) for the opening scene, but was ultimately scrapped during the second draft. Yes, the U.S. would have retaliated while those at Gitmo would hold a defensive war against the Cubans. However, fighting a war in a middle of a zombie apocalypse is not the smartest thing to do.
Would the Cubans need to attack Gitmo? They already have the borders with it well fortified and with the US collapsing it wouldn't be able to last long even if zombies don't reach the enclave.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jan 30, 2021 11:56:19 GMT
In many instances i have seen cruise liners transporting people in a zombie Apocalypse/deadly virus outbreak in movies, books ore series, there is always a person infected onboard. Since this takes place in the Romero universe, anyone that dies of non-zombie related deaths such as heart attack will also reanimate and bite several others. I wonder how long the Cubans could hold out, considering that they rely on the USSR for supplies. Best bet for Cuba to survive is to screen all refugees and kill those with bites or other non-treatable diseases. The tropical climate would ensure that the zombies rot faster.
Ouch. Strictly speaking that means that anyone who dies needs to be cremated, one way or another, very quickly. Very nasty. Also means that cultures than dislike cremation and/or have elaborate ceremonies for preparing the dead before disposal of the body are going to be in deep trouble.
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 30, 2021 12:09:45 GMT
Would the Cubans need to attack Gitmo? They already have the borders with it well fortified and with the US collapsing it wouldn't be able to last long even if zombies don't reach the enclave. If the U.S. launches retaliatory strikes on Cuba in response for sinking American refugee boats, Cuba would consider itself at war and Guantanamo Bay would be fair game. Ouch. Strictly speaking that means that anyone who dies needs to be cremated, one way or another, very quickly. Very nasty. Also means that cultures than dislike cremation and/or have elaborate ceremonies for preparing the dead before disposal of the body are going to be in deep trouble. Yeah, the Cubans would probably do that. It was stated in Night of the Living Dead (1968) that bodies have to be burned just to make sure to kill the radiation or virus that causes corpses to reanimate. Nonetheless, it has been proven that a zombie killed by a head shot or other brain trauma will not come back to life again. Burning them is just to be sure. |
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ukron
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Post by ukron on Jun 4, 2021 13:01:55 GMT
France in 1984 would probably ended up like USA, maybe with some luck, some military reinforcements can arrive from West Germany and Overseas but eventually the fall of Paris would mean a lot.
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jun 4, 2021 13:08:40 GMT
France in 1984 would probably ended up like USA, maybe with some luck, some military reinforcements can arrive from West Germany and Overseas but eventually the fall of Paris would mean a lot. Mitterand may evacuate to Verdun Air Base. Places like Pyrenes and Corsica may be safe. Perhaps have the Charles de Gaulle, Foch, and Clemenceau secure Corsica. If I remember correctly, there are French military forces in Chad and Lebanon at this period. If the situation gets too desperate, unleash the Force de Frappe. |
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