stevep
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Post by stevep on Mar 24, 2018 11:55:14 GMT
There is of course another potential problem for the EU in such an event. What happens if it occurs while the EU's parliament and bureaucracy are in Strasbourg rather than Brussels? It could end up largely decapitated in terms of its leadership which could further complicate matters.
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steffen
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Post by steffen on Mar 26, 2018 19:47:13 GMT
Hi, please read exactly what i wrote. 1.) i said that the foreign-french would liberate the country - at last in my eyes the installation of modern civilisation in france is a liberation, esp. equal rights to woman, gay etc, also the chance to develop, increase medicine healthcare... 2.) the foreign french need to remove the leadership of that 1870-france. Because these leaders are not compatible with modern world (again - that is my opinion about that). 3.) there is no war or such thing. At last that is my opinion. So i can´t see the "occupation forces". we totally disagree about how old-style-france in that scenario is lead to modern times. Propably so much that it is useless to discuss it, cause you allways come with things i never wrote or said, so it is near impossible to discuss such things. Please use the stuff the other person write, okay? 4.) my impression is, that the adult french of 1870 are "useless" in the sense that they could fully adopt to the modern world. They are born and raised in pre-historic times (to say so), with a complete different morale and social ideology. Again the same is true for all other countries, that is nothing special about france. So - my idea - is to teach and train the kids, that could adopted into the new modern world. The old ones aren´t useless, they will not be mistreated, but my feeling is, that you can´t move people from 1870 to 2018 if they are fully grown up and socialised. Esp if they never heared or saw the things that are common in our times. We do not even discuss ethic values (again - france 1870 - ready to go to war by a fictional insult, modern world : ha ha ha... what do you say? really, well who cares - that is the reaction of modern people to such "insult"). A lot of these people could adjust themself to modern standards, but not in the way that they 100% adjust. Even modern people can´t partly follow the development, the accelerated change. How should people who do not know what a car or airplane is achive that? But please stop this underlaying message you allways did. Really... i write what i think, if you belive it is something different, feel free to ask. But - as we found out in the other thread, your imaginated "insults" do not exist. The same here. My conclusion: small military unit enters france, take out the leadership, start modernisation with the help by european partners. Beside some diehard-extremists the others will be quite happy because they get acceptable medicine support, better healthcare, working conditions, improvements in all areas. If you see it different - feel free to explain it. But - untill now here i miss points from you. I described quite detailed why i think that X or Y happens. Now it is your turn. Thank you. My underlying message is that I think X, Y, Z and give arguments for them. Your underlying message seems to be N, O, P are right because you say so and any alternative viewpoint must be wrong because you disagree with it. For instance you continue to deny that people will object to a sudden and violent invasion. Or that a small and isolated force can compel tens of millions of people to behave as they wish without any explanation as to how. [Leaving aside your desire to ignore recorded history.] Furthermore, just because you decide that insults aren't insults doesn't make you right. You need a slave alongside you on that chariot your riding. [Even if your done nothing I'm aware of to merit a Triumphant yet] Well, first of all i couldn´t care less if someone - here you - see imagination "insults" - and want to be insulted. Sorry for the harsh words, but i did not insult anybody, you failed to answer every single question about what i wrote - just the "i got insulted by "occupation forces". The fun fact about that is, you just get "insulted" by the word, i had no internal "blaming", no "evil british occupayers did this or that", nope. Just writing facts. In 1979 the british armed forces in western germany were - well occupation forces. They had special rights, the german government couldn´t say "leave", all because of ww2 and the following 3 western winning states creating their occupation zones they unified but still had controll about, if they choosed to do so. Otherwise there would be no need for the 2+4 treaty negotiations. So yes, you feel insulted by reality. Answer the questions i asked, like "would the british army leave germany completly if the german government had said "we want to be free from any military forces" (full neutral, full disarmed country). The answer is nope. And so occupation forces are still occupation forces. I just don´t get it why you are insulted by facts? No "kid eating brutals" hanging around, with some raping fun. Never wrote that, never meant that. But if you have foreign armed forces in your country that have special rights (above your own), could decide if they leave or not even against the will of the elected government of the full democratic state, that fullfill in any meaning the definition of occupation forces. They also had to leave after the 2+4treaty had signed. Just guess why? I even linked you to the british discussion about an unified germany - in 1990, 11 years after that event should happen. And again no, i never meant an invasion. I explained in detail what i meant and how it would work. You seem to ignore the things other persons write, because it suits you. That is sad, because i have no quarell with you, i can´t understood why you "create" such problems. As a democratic guy i accept different opinions, even if they are wrong. Just as your insulted behaviour is wrong, cause i did not insult somebody by calling facts - or would you say you get insulted if one say 2+2 = 4? - so you critisize stuff i wrote in a manner that could be called "insulting". Because i never said that a full scale invasion would happen. I wrote that a french armored unit move fast through france, take out the outdated military leaders (you need to do that) and also remove Napoleon the IIIrd, a brutal dictator who is - from a modern POV inacteptable for EVERY serious political party. A guy who get "insulted" (hm, ... )by someone accepting his inacceptable demands, who got insulted because the country he declared war defeated another country easier as himself! (1866 versus 1859) is no stable person somebody want to discuss the rebuild of his backyarded country. Esp. if modern french hanging around just next to the border(s) in spain, belgium, germany, switzerland, who could establish a new government till the old-french realize the shock they had suffered by moving them from 1870 to 2018. I had written this for what? 4 times, you still repeat "invasion". An invasion would be the full military force of all other european countries, destroying the whole french army (old) in 10 minutes. Add in the - from your person mentioned mass excecutings, shootings etc, you seem to be obsessed by. All i wrote was that say 10 tanks, 20 armored cars, 20 armored transporters with some extra fuel trucks move in, take out any resistance - helped by helicopter moved forces that arrest the leadership of the military at the places they are, give orders in their names (again, the people couldn´t differ the signed orders - modern copies do wonders) so everybody sit in its baracks. Because the modern world exactly knows at witch place what general or war moronger sits, it is very easy for FRENCH forces from german bases or belgium bases to take em out. Also, no invasion happens. Just massive support in food, medical supplies, healthcare, development, build up infrastructures, etc. I don´t see "old" french people start slaying french speaking doctors who treat the ill "old" french woman and kids... maybe you seem to think these people are war mad brutal killers, for me they are incompatible with the 2018-world, they could try to reduce the gap to the modern world, but will allways be behind (that is the last part in that you tried to do something strange with the things i wrote). The development from stoneage to 1870 was less then from 1870 to 2018. It is a full cultural, economic, social shock for adults, who are socialised in a full different world. So i concentrated on the kids, hopefully they will close the gap easily, beeing able to live happy in the modern world. The older ones need help, but will allways be distant from the wonders of cars, airplanes, computers, internet, TV, maybe radio will help? Why you seem to change this into something evil is beyond my imagination. It seems to be a pattern... really i suggest you don´t see in other people comments the plain evil.
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lordroel
Administrator
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Post by lordroel on Mar 27, 2018 2:57:36 GMT
My underlying message is that I think X, Y, Z and give arguments for them. Your underlying message seems to be N, O, P are right because you say so and any alternative viewpoint must be wrong because you disagree with it. For instance you continue to deny that people will object to a sudden and violent invasion. Or that a small and isolated force can compel tens of millions of people to behave as they wish without any explanation as to how. [Leaving aside your desire to ignore recorded history.] Furthermore, just because you decide that insults aren't insults doesn't make you right. You need a slave alongside you on that chariot your riding. [Even if your done nothing I'm aware of to merit a Triumphant yet] Well, first of all i couldn´t care less if someone - here you - see imagination "insults" - and want to be insulted. Sorry for the harsh words, but i did not insult anybody, you failed to answer every single question about what i wrote - just the "i got insulted by "occupation forces". The fun fact about that is, you just get "insulted" by the word, i had no internal "blaming", no "evil british occupayers did this or that", nope. Just writing facts. In 1979 the british armed forces in western germany were - well occupation forces. They had special rights, the german government couldn´t say "leave", all because of ww2 and the following 3 western winning states creating their occupation zones they unified but still had controll about, if they choosed to do so. Otherwise there would be no need for the 2+4 treaty negotiations. So yes, you feel insulted by reality. Answer the questions i asked, like "would the british army leave germany completly if the german government had said "we want to be free from any military forces" (full neutral, full disarmed country). The answer is nope. And so occupation forces are still occupation forces. I just don´t get it why you are insulted by facts? No "kid eating brutals" hanging around, with some raping fun. Never wrote that, never meant that. But if you have foreign armed forces in your country that have special rights (above your own), could decide if they leave or not even against the will of the elected government of the full democratic state, that fullfill in any meaning the definition of occupation forces. They also had to leave after the 2+4treaty had signed. Just guess why? I even linked you to the british discussion about an unified germany - in 1990, 11 years after that event should happen. And again no, i never meant an invasion. I explained in detail what i meant and how it would work. You seem to ignore the things other persons write, because it suits you. That is sad, because i have no quarell with you, i can´t understood why you "create" such problems. As a democratic guy i accept different opinions, even if they are wrong. Just as your insulted behaviour is wrong, cause i did not insult somebody by calling facts - or would you say you get insulted if one say 2+2 = 4? - so you critisize stuff i wrote in a manner that could be called "insulting". Because i never said that a full scale invasion would happen. I wrote that a french armored unit move fast through france, take out the outdated military leaders (you need to do that) and also remove Napoleon the IIIrd, a brutal dictator who is - from a modern POV inacteptable for EVERY serious political party. A guy who get "insulted" (hm, ... )by someone accepting his inacceptable demands, who got insulted because the country he declared war defeated another country easier as himself! (1866 versus 1859) is no stable person somebody want to discuss the rebuild of his backyarded country. Esp. if modern french hanging around just next to the border(s) in spain, belgium, germany, switzerland, who could establish a new government till the old-french realize the shock they had suffered by moving them from 1870 to 2018. I had written this for what? 4 times, you still repeat "invasion". An invasion would be the full military force of all other european countries, destroying the whole french army (old) in 10 minutes. Add in the - from your person mentioned mass excecutings, shootings etc, you seem to be obsessed by. All i wrote was that say 10 tanks, 20 armored cars, 20 armored transporters with some extra fuel trucks move in, take out any resistance - helped by helicopter moved forces that arrest the leadership of the military at the places they are, give orders in their names (again, the people couldn´t differ the signed orders - modern copies do wonders) so everybody sit in its baracks. Because the modern world exactly knows at witch place what general or war moronger sits, it is very easy for FRENCH forces from german bases or belgium bases to take em out. Also, no invasion happens. Just massive support in food, medical supplies, healthcare, development, build up infrastructures, etc. I don´t see "old" french people start slaying french speaking doctors who treat the ill "old" french woman and kids... maybe you seem to think these people are war mad brutal killers, for me they are incompatible with the 2018-world, they could try to reduce the gap to the modern world, but will allways be behind (that is the last part in that you tried to do something strange with the things i wrote). The development from stoneage to 1870 was less then from 1870 to 2018. It is a full cultural, economic, social shock for adults, who are socialised in a full different world. So i concentrated on the kids, hopefully they will close the gap easily, beeing able to live happy in the modern world. The older ones need help, but will allways be distant from the wonders of cars, airplanes, computers, internet, TV, maybe radio will help? Why you seem to change this into something evil is beyond my imagination. It seems to be a pattern... really i suggest you don´t see in other people comments the plain evil. steffen nobody is insulting anybody here, so do not say these things, i do not like that here, any problems and you can PM me ore a mod.
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stevep
Fleet admiral
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Post by stevep on Mar 27, 2018 10:28:48 GMT
Lordroel & all
I have decided its not worthwhile communicating with Steffen any more because of his closed mindset that everything he said will occur because he says so and gets enraged whenever anyone dares to suggest his plans might cause problems. Hence I have set to ignore his posts and hopefully that will be the end of the matter.
Steve
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