miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 8, 2023 20:09:17 GMT
There were several European states where people tried to make a revolution, and neither was very successful. Do you want all of them to succeed? France, Austria-Hungary and Italy in the "republics" column would have balanced out the "crazies". |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 9, 2023 11:36:30 GMT
There were several European states where people tried to make a revolution, and neither was very successful. Do you want all of them to succeed? France, Austria-Hungary and Italy in the "republics" column would have balanced out the "crazies".
That assumes that republics can't produce crazies themselves.  |
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 9, 2023 11:49:57 GMT
That assumes that republics can't produce crazies themselves. We generally do not have that problem; since we only vomit up defectives (Trump (demagogue), Wilson (racist), Johnson (Texan) and Biden (crook)) when we are "bored". The crazies, like Wilhelm and George and Nick, tend to be inevitable in "monarchies" due to "inbreeding". You do understand WWI was made worse because of this? |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 10, 2023 15:50:51 GMT
That assumes that republics can't produce crazies themselves. We generally do not have that problem; since we only vomit up defectives (Trump (demagogue), Wilson (racist), Johnson (Texan) and Biden (crook)) when we are "bored". The crazies, like Wilhelm and George and Nick, tend to be inevitable in "monarchies" due to "inbreeding". You do understand WWI was made worse because of this?
The US have had their own problems but I was thinking more of Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, the Soviet and Chinese communists empires which are technically republics of one type or another.
The only significant republic involved in WWI - other than the US near the end - was France and even without the occupation of much of their territory they were pretty fanatically about their approach to the war. Wilhelm was pretty extreme and Nicholas was pretty stupid while George had relatively little role in the war. Monarchies don't automatically result in inbreeding - that takes a level of stupidity, especially in the more knowledgeable recent centuries or so. The problem is more in terms of closed mental attitudes, which is a problem with many powerful ruling elites, not just monarchies. As such again your last statement is wrong.
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 10, 2023 17:29:16 GMT
Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, the Soviet and Chinese communists empires which are technically republics of one type or another. Those were "one person top down rule" states which substituted dictators for inbred monarchs. They NEVER were republics. |
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Post by AlternateTurtle on Jul 15, 2023 23:12:50 GMT
'What if the 1851 French coup d'état fails?'
How will this affect the French colonies, especially those in North Africa? Would Louis-Napoléon Bonaparte be arrrested or killed?
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Post by diamondstorm on Jul 16, 2023 16:41:27 GMT
In a scenario where the USA breaks up sometime in the 1790s due to no ratifying the Constitution, would it be possible for Vermont and trans-Appalachian North Carolina to attempt to assert statehood under the Articles of Confederation, especially with Kentucky admitted into the USA as a state as planned in 1788? Or at least would attempted separation from New York and North Carolina be possible even if as just territories rather than states?
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 16, 2023 21:12:19 GMT
'What if the 1851 French coup d'état fails?' How will this affect the French colonies, especially those in North Africa? Would Louis-Napoléon Bonaparte be arrested or killed? I expect prison time, but not execution. The army would not stand for it. The North African territories were in a state of perpetual semi-revolt and banditry. I think it would be situation normal, send out the patrols for the French garrisons. |
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mspence
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Post by mspence on Jul 23, 2023 6:35:51 GMT
Texas listens to Sam Houston and stays loyal during the Civil War.
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 23, 2023 7:47:58 GMT
Texas listens to Sam Houston and stays loyal during the Civil War. I expect Texas to become like Kentucky or Missouri; a civil war inside the Civil War. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 23, 2023 8:23:33 GMT
Texas listens to Sam Houston and stays loyal during the Civil War. I expect Texas to become like Kentucky or Missouri; a civil war inside the Civil War. Same as what happen in Kentucky and Missouri. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 23, 2023 12:06:39 GMT
Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, the Soviet and Chinese communists empires which are technically republics of one type or another. Those were "one person top down rule" states which substituted dictators for inbred monarchs. They NEVER were republics.
Forgot to reply to this. Tell that to the states that fell to those assorted dictatorships. I think most people in Wiamar Germany or pre-Mussolini Italy would question your view. Russia and China were only briefly and unreliably republics but the dictatorships that followed were due in large part to the failings of those republics.
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 23, 2023 16:43:09 GMT
Those were "one person top down rule" states which substituted dictators for inbred monarchs. They NEVER were republics.
Forgot to reply to this. Tell that to the states that fell to those assorted dictatorships. I think most people in Wiamar Germany or pre-Mussolini Italy would question your view. Russia and China were only briefly and unreliably republics but the dictatorships that followed were due in large part to the failings of those republics.
Republics (rule of law) never tolerate right wing or left wing extremists rioting in their streets. States without law, generally do not process seditionists properly via public trial and due process under a constitution. Hence; Weimar was never a republic, since they allowed those rioters. Italy was never a republic until they got rid of their king and his personal influence on the justice system, China, bandit era, was never a republic. Russia, filled with chekists and gangsters, was never a republic. When you can see "strong person / Caudillo" presences, or utter chaos, you have rule of goons, not a republic. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 23, 2023 22:03:41 GMT
Forgot to reply to this. Tell that to the states that fell to those assorted dictatorships. I think most people in Wiamar Germany or pre-Mussolini Italy would question your view. Russia and China were only briefly and unreliably republics but the dictatorships that followed were due in large part to the failings of those republics.
Republics (rule of law) never tolerate right wing or left wing extremists rioting in their streets. States without law, generally do not process seditionists properly via public trial and due process under a constitution. Hence; Weimar was never a republic, since they allowed those rioters. Italy was never a republic until they got rid of their king and his personal influence on the justice system, China, bandit era, was never a republic. Russia, filled with chekists and gangsters, was never a republic. When you can see "strong person / Caudillo" presences, or utter chaos, you have rule of goons, not a republic.
That's a definite that basically says its only a republic if I say it is. Also this bit suggests the US during the civil war wasn't a republic.
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on Jul 23, 2023 23:36:50 GMT
Republics (rule of law) never tolerate right wing or left wing extremists rioting in their streets. States without law, generally do not process seditionists properly via public trial and due process under a constitution. Hence; Weimar was never a republic, since they allowed those rioters. Italy was never a republic until they got rid of their king and his personal influence on the justice system, China, bandit era, was never a republic. Russia, filled with chekists and gangsters, was never a republic. When you can see "strong person / Caudillo" presences, or utter chaos, you have rule of goons, not a republic.
That's a definite that basically says its only a republic if I say it is. Also this bit suggests the US during the civil war wasn't a republic.
The definition is quite clear. None, of the so-called self-defined "republics" you listed is one, by that definition set; which is not what "I" say it is; but what is commonly accepted among political scientists. |
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