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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 23, 2024 23:10:35 GMT
What if for whatever reason the Gothic War does not happen? Justinian will have more troops available for a war against Persia.
What does it mean for Italy? |
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Post by Max Sinister on Jul 24, 2024 0:26:37 GMT
Justinian will have more troops available for a war against Persia.
What does it mean for Italy? Well, the Ostrogoths will still be around (and squabble a lot among themselves, if a historical novel by Felix Dahn is an indication). Same thing for the Visigoths. And the Langobards will have to fight the Avars - or go somewhere else.
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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 24, 2024 6:17:36 GMT
AHC/WI: Sweet potato replaces rice and wheat as the main crop in China.
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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 24, 2024 16:05:03 GMT
WI: no Frederick William I of Prussia
What if The Soldier King is simply never born?
What happens to Prussia given that no Frederick William I means no military reforms, no Frederick the Great and no rise of Prussia as a great power?
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 24, 2024 17:27:21 GMT
WI: no Frederick William I of Prussia What if The Soldier King is simply never born? What happens to Prussia given that no Frederick William I means no military reforms, no Frederick the Great and no rise of Prussia as a great power?
The two points that come to mind are: a) That the smaller but richer Saxon state stays the primary Protestant power in NE Germany b) Austria never loses Silesia. Which not only boost the power of the monarchy but also by meaning the empire has a large German state NE of Bohemia as well as the OTL Sudetenland and Austrian lands to the SE. As such the Czechs in Bohemia, of which Silesia was a part until its loss to Prussia, would be under greater pressure to be Germanized and could have greater problems to establish themself as an independent nation if something like the OTL collapse of the Hapsburg empire occurs as their pretty much surrounded by Germans from a common state.
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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 24, 2024 17:44:19 GMT
WI: no Frederick William I of Prussia What if The Soldier King is simply never born? What happens to Prussia given that no Frederick William I means no military reforms, no Frederick the Great and no rise of Prussia as a great power?
The two points that come to mind are: a) That the smaller but richer Saxon state stays the primary Protestant power in NE Germany b) Austria never loses Silesia. Which not only boost the power of the monarchy but also by meaning the empire has a large German state NE of Bohemia as well as the OTL Sudetenland and Austrian lands to the SE. As such the Czechs in Bohemia, of which Silesia was a part until its loss to Prussia, would be under greater pressure to be Germanized and could have greater problems to establish themself as an independent nation if something like the OTL collapse of the Hapsburg empire occurs as their pretty much surrounded by Germans from a common state.
Does Austria stand a higher chance of unifying Germany then? |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 24, 2024 19:32:40 GMT
The two points that come to mind are: a) That the smaller but richer Saxon state stays the primary Protestant power in NE Germany b) Austria never loses Silesia. Which not only boost the power of the monarchy but also by meaning the empire has a large German state NE of Bohemia as well as the OTL Sudetenland and Austrian lands to the SE. As such the Czechs in Bohemia, of which Silesia was a part until its loss to Prussia, would be under greater pressure to be Germanized and could have greater problems to establish themself as an independent nation if something like the OTL collapse of the Hapsburg empire occurs as their pretty much surrounded by Germans from a common state.
Does Austria stand a higher chance of unifying Germany then?
Well it removed the OTL primary rival and keeping Silesia will make Austria stronger. However the Hapsburg's still face two issues. a) Until nationalism is a significant factor any unification of Germany under Austria - especially if it kept its non-German territories - would be a huge threat to just about every other power in Europe, including of course other German states. Once nationalism becomes a significant factor then the external powers would still be worried but smaller German states would have less capacity to oppose such a unification. b) However once nationalism becomes significant in you have the problem of the vast non-German territories of the empire. The Hapsburg's have to decide whether their a German dynasty or continue to be a multi-national one, despite the growing importance of nationalism. Both because at least some Germans won't want significant non-German populations inside 'their' state, at least as equal citizens and also those non-Germans will not want to be discriminated against, especially if their own national language/culture etc and their own natural response to such a threat is to seek their own national state/independence.
As such I can't see Austria both unifying Germany under their rule and maintaining without a lot of conflict control over their own non-German territories at the same time.
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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 24, 2024 19:51:15 GMT
stevep if Austria chooses to be the German state - would their version of Germany be better than the Prussian one? I know that with a PoD so far back all 19th and early 20th century wars are butterflied away but maybe it's possible to draw even broad conclusions?
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 24, 2024 22:11:53 GMT
stevep if Austria chooses to be the German state - would their version of Germany be better than the Prussian one? I know that with a PoD so far back all 19th and early 20th century wars are butterflied away but maybe it's possible to draw even broad conclusions?
It might depend on the question of what's better and also what period of time, as well as the many other variables. For instance an Hapsburg ruled Germany is likely to be more bureaucratic, more socially conservative and less militaristic unless there's major changes in its character to achieve that situation.
If an Hapsburg Germany is defeated as OTL Germany was in some 1914-18 equivalent and the monarchy falls then it could be every bit as evil as OTL Nazi Germany was or it might still be different. You may be unlikely to have an intervening Wiemar type government that is overall as liberal as OTL was but again that could depend on the events of the imperial fall. Mind you a somewhat less militaristic Hapsburg Germany, with also possibly more experience in using diplomacy over the centuries might be less likely to get into a 1914 type of scenario. Again this is all fairly wild speculation.
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Post by Max Sinister on Jul 25, 2024 1:03:08 GMT
The nazis needed the Prussian military tradition. Not because it was evil per se, but because it was useful for total war.
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Post by Otto Kretschmer on Jul 25, 2024 8:26:29 GMT
AHC/WI: Abbasid Caliphate does not fracture.
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kasumigenx
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Post by kasumigenx on Jul 28, 2024 19:04:01 GMT
What if the Blacks in South Africa are Muslims, how would that affect the segregation or apartheid in south africa?
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 28, 2024 22:43:12 GMT
What if the Blacks in South Africa are Muslims, how would that affect the segregation or apartheid in south africa?
You would 1st need to decide how they became Muslim? Arab slavers reaching the region and plundering it before being drive out by westerners? Or a generally wider spread expansion of Muslim conquests and conversions? - Although since the 1st Europeans who reached the cape did so just before 1500AD that would need to be speeded up a lot and it would be difficult to see Europeans driving such a Muslin emirate out of the region and gaining control, at least until say ~1800-1850, which would kind of screw the history of western trade and colonization prior to that date so you would have a radically different world.
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kasumigenx
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Post by kasumigenx on Jul 29, 2024 5:19:13 GMT
What if the Blacks in South Africa are Muslims, how would that affect the segregation or apartheid in south africa?
You would 1st need to decide how they became Muslim? Arab slavers reaching the region and plundering it before being drive out by westerners? Or a generally wider spread expansion of Muslim conquests and conversions? - Although since the 1st Europeans who reached the cape did so just before 1500AD that would need to be speeded up a lot and it would be difficult to see Europeans driving such a Muslin emirate out of the region and gaining control, at least until say ~1800-1850, which would kind of screw the history of western trade and colonization prior to that date so you would have a radically different world.
Perhaps we can have the Bantu tribes turn Muslim before going to South Africa. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 29, 2024 8:52:52 GMT
You would 1st need to decide how they became Muslim? Arab slavers reaching the region and plundering it before being drive out by westerners? Or a generally wider spread expansion of Muslim conquests and conversions? - Although since the 1st Europeans who reached the cape did so just before 1500AD that would need to be speeded up a lot and it would be difficult to see Europeans driving such a Muslin emirate out of the region and gaining control, at least until say ~1800-1850, which would kind of screw the history of western trade and colonization prior to that date so you would have a radically different world.
Perhaps we can have the Bantu tribes turn Muslim before going to South Africa.
Possibly although that would need Islam spreading a lot faster to convert them say in the Congo basin and then they still head south. Which is going to make for massive changes in African culture. Its going to be very hard for a western, Christian culture to establish themselves in just about any part of Africa and suppressing slavery. Your likely never to see significant colonization in western and central Africa as it simply wouldn't be worth it. It would also mean that the slave trade to the Americas would be affected. Would Muslim rulers be willing to sell some of their slaves to Christian Europeans. Especially since if Islam has conquered all of W Africa its probably linked into a wider trade network so could get guns and other such items across the Sahara. If they were willing to sell slaves then you have Muslim slaves in the Americans and how persistent would their faith be.
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