oscssw
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Post by oscssw on Apr 27, 2022 12:37:24 GMT
Well I guess it is time to put my money where my big mouth is.  This is my idea of how SMS Bismarck and USS North Carolina could fight it out. The point of divergence between this ATL and the OTL is
5 Feb ‘37 BB-55 Keel laid. New York Naval Shipyard (NYNSY)
1 Oct Feb ‘39 BB-55 Launched (NYNSY)
5 Nov ‘40 BB-55 Commissioned (NYNSY) 25 Nov ‘40 BB-55 installation of Mark 3 radar sets for the main battery, Mark 4 radars for the secondary guns, a CXAM-1 search radar, at (NYNSY)
1 Dec 1940 BB-55 departs Boston Naval Shipyard for her shakedown cruise in the Caribbean 28 Feb 1941 BB-55 Completes shakedown cruise, is homeported in Boston and Chops to the Neutrality Patrol.
1 Mar 1941 BB-55 Captain Willis Augustus "Ching" Lee, Jr, assumes command. Lee's specialty in life was gunnery. At the age of 19 in 1907 "he became the only American to win both the US National High Power Rifle and Pistol championships in the same year." In 1914 during the Vera Cruz campaign in Mexico he drew the fire of three enemy snipers, thereby exposing their positions and then shot them at long range. He understood the powerful guns of a battleship as an extension of the law of ballistics and adapted his expertise to the new age of technology. Yup, I'm stacking the deck. 
2 Mar 1941 BB-55 engaged in rigorous training in gunnery and the use of her new search and fire control radars.
I know I'm fudging the dates to assure Bismarck and The showboat meet and still use as much of the OTL Bismarck's last cruise. I fear the RN's run of bad luck is about to get worse or maybe not? 
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 12:48:04 GMT
Well I guess it is time to put my money where my big mouth is. This is my idea of how SMS Bismarck and USS North Carolina could fight it out. The point of divergence between this ATL and the OTL is
5 Feb ‘37 BB-55 Keel laid. New York Naval Shipyard (NYNSY)
1 Oct Feb ‘39 BB-55 Launched (NYNSY)
5 Nov ‘40 BB-55 Commissioned (NYNSY) 25 Nov ‘40 BB-55 installation of Mark 3 radar sets for the main battery, Mark 4 radars for the secondary guns, a CXAM-1 search radar, at (NYNSY)
1 Dec 1940 BB-55 departs Boston Naval Shipyard for her shakedown cruise in the Caribbean 28 Feb 1941 BB-55 Completes shakedown cruise, is homeported in Boston and Chops to the Neutrality Patrol.
1 Mar 1941 BB-55 Captain Willis Augustus "Ching" Lee, Jr, assumes command. Lee's specialty in life was gunnery. At the age of 19 in 1907 "he became the only American to win both the US National High Power Rifle and Pistol championships in the same year." In 1914 during the Vera Cruz campaign in Mexico he drew the fire of three enemy snipers, thereby exposing their positions and then shot them at long range. He understood the powerful guns of a battleship as an extension of the law of ballistics and adapted his expertise to the new age of technology. Yup, I'm stacking the deck.
2 Mar 1941 BB-55 engaged in rigorous training in gunnery and the use of her new search and fire control radars.
I know I'm fudging the dates to assure Bismarck and The showboat meet and still use as much of the OTL Bismarck's last cruise. I fear the RN's run of bad luck is about to get worse or maybe not?
Nice Senior Chief ( oscssw ), if i remember correctly, somebody on NavWeaps Forums (Naval Fiction) also tried to get get both SHOWBOAT verus the THE IRON CHANCELLOR, it was called the The Showboat Saga. |
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1bigrich
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Post by 1bigrich on Apr 27, 2022 13:10:06 GMT
28 Feb 1941 BB-55 Completes shakedown cruise, is homeported in Boston and Chops to the Neutrality Patrol.
1 Mar 1941 BB-55 Captain Willis Augustus "Ching" Lee, Jr, assumes command. Lee's specialty in life was gunnery. At the age of 19 in 1907 "he became the only American to win both the US National High Power Rifle and Pistol championships in the same year." Olympic gold medalist at Antwerp in 1920 as well (five gold, a silver and a bronze) Seven medals for Lee and his team mate Spooner was a record, not equaled until 1960, not broken until 1980. How did Lee not win a medal for that? Exposing himself to enemy fire because his men were pinned down and removing the threat from not one but THREE snipers seems like there should have been a Navy Cross or Silver Star in there somewhere... Great scenario, Senior Chief. And not that much fudging. North Carolina could have been laid down earlier, but the USN delayed laying new battleships down historically, unlike the RN that laid down King George V and Prince of Wales on 1 Jan 1937... Hope to see more! Regards, |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 13:13:06 GMT
Olympic gold medalist at Antwerp in 1920 as well (five gold, a silver and a bronze) Seven medals for Lee and his team mate Spooner was record, not equaled until 1960, not broken until 1980. What the heck, which events did he take to get so many medals. |
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1bigrich
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Post by 1bigrich on Apr 27, 2022 13:21:08 GMT
Nice Senior Chief ( oscssw ), if i remember correctly, somebody on NavWeaps Forums (Naval Fiction) also tried to get get both SHOWBOAT verus the THE IRON CHANCELLOR, it was called the The Showboat Saga. Gunner Bob, as I recall, from the Naval Fiction board over at NavWeaps/Warships1. He subsequently revised the story (again as I recall) with a different, larger North Carolina. North Carolina got the Nickname "The Showboat" from her sister Washington. When both commissioned they were in New York, with North Carolina testing various propeller combinations because of the vibration problems from the use of the skegs in the design. She was steaming in and out of the Brooklyn Navy Yard to test them, and on one return Washington's band gathered on the Quarter Deck and played "Here comes that Showboat" from the Broadway musical "Showboat" that was undergoing a revival at the time. The nickname stuck ever since.... Regards, |
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1bigrich
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Post by 1bigrich on Apr 27, 2022 13:25:06 GMT
What the heck, which events did he take to get so many medals. All in team shooting events. Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 50 m small bore rifle Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 300 m army rifle, prone Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 600 m free rifle Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team free rifle, 300 m + 600 m Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team free rifle Silver medal – second place 1920 Antwerp Team 300 m army rifle, standing Bronze medal – third place 1920 Antwerp Team 100 m running deer, single shots Lee had a number of different teammates, but he and Spooner got the most medals. Regards, |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 13:26:36 GMT
What the heck, which events did he take to get so many medals. All in team shooting events. Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 50 m small bore rifle Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 300 m army rifle, prone Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team 600 m free rifle Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team free rifle, 300 m + 600 m Gold medal – first place 1920 Antwerp Team free rifle Silver medal – second place 1920 Antwerp Team 300 m army rifle, standing Bronze medal – third place 1920 Antwerp Team 100 m running deer, single shots Lee had a number of different teammates, but he and Spooner got the most medals. Regards, I asumed it had to do something with shooting, thanks for the responds 1bigrich, now we can back to the thread. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 13:35:38 GMT
Well I guess it is time to put my money where my big mouth is. This is my idea of how SMS Bismarck and USS North Carolina could fight it out. The point of divergence between this ATL and the OTL is
5 Feb ‘37 BB-55 Keel laid. New York Naval Shipyard (NYNSY)
So here keel is laid if i count it correctly 7 moths earlier than OTL. |
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575
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Post by 575 on Apr 27, 2022 14:06:47 GMT
Staying tuned - so the Showboat will be cruising around southern Greenland/Icland Gap during mid- May 1941?
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 15:34:35 GMT
Staying tuned - so the Showboat will be cruising around southern Greenland/Icland Gap during mid- May 1941? As long as the SHOWBOAT (USS North Carolina) has some escort with here as she will not only encounter the IRON CHANCELLOR (KMS Bismarck) but also a PRINCE (KMS Prins Eugen). |
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oscssw
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Post by oscssw on Apr 27, 2022 16:39:43 GMT
Well I guess it is time to put my money where my big mouth is. This is my idea of how SMS Bismarck and USS North Carolina could fight it out. The point of divergence between this ATL and the OTL is
5 Feb ‘37 BB-55 Keel laid. New York Naval Shipyard (NYNSY)
So here keel is laid if i count it correctly 7 moths earlier than OTL. She had to get all the way through her shakedown and join the Neutrality patrol before she could meet up with Bismarck in May of '41.
BB-55 OTL dates Ordered 1 August 1937
Builder New York Naval Shipyard
Laid down 27 October 1937
Launched 13 June 1940
Commissioned 9 April 1941 |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 16:46:28 GMT
So here keel is laid if i count it correctly 7 moths earlier than OTL. She had to get all the way through her shakedown and join the Neutrality patrol before she could meet up with Bismarck in May of '41.
BB-55 OTL dates Ordered 1 August 1937
Builder New York Naval Shipyard
Laid down 27 October 1937
Launched 13 June 1940
Commissioned 9 April 1941Is here sister ship also build several months ahead of their OTL date ore only SHOWBOAT (USS North Carolina). |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 16:47:12 GMT
Nice Senior Chief ( oscssw ), if i remember correctly, somebody on NavWeaps Forums (Naval Fiction) also tried to get get both SHOWBOAT verus the THE IRON CHANCELLOR, it was called the The Showboat Saga. Gunner Bob, as I recall, from the Naval Fiction board over at NavWeaps/Warships1. He subsequently revised the story (again as I recall) with a different, larger North Carolina. Regards, That is the TL i was thinking of 1bigrich . |
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oscssw
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Post by oscssw on Apr 27, 2022 17:33:05 GMT
Well I guess it is time to put my money where my big mouth is. This is my idea of how SMS Bismarck and USS North Carolina could fight it out. The point of divergence between this ATL and the OTL is
5 Feb ‘37 BB-55 Keel laid. New York Naval Shipyard (NYNSY)
1 Oct Feb ‘39 BB-55 Launched (NYNSY)
5 Nov ‘40 BB-55 Commissioned (NYNSY) 25 Nov ‘40 BB-55 installation of Mark 3 radar sets for the main battery, Mark 4 radars for the secondary guns, a CXAM-1 search radar, at (NYNSY)
1 Dec 1940 BB-55 departs Boston Naval Shipyard for her shakedown cruise in the Caribbean 28 Feb 1941 BB-55 Completes shakedown cruise, is homeported in Boston and Chops to the Neutrality Patrol.
1 Mar 1941 BB-55 Captain Willis Augustus "Ching" Lee, Jr, assumes command. Lee's specialty in life was gunnery. At the age of 19 in 1907 "he became the only American to win both the US National High Power Rifle and Pistol championships in the same year." In 1914 during the Vera Cruz campaign in Mexico he drew the fire of three enemy snipers, thereby exposing their positions and then shot them at long range. He understood the powerful guns of a battleship as an extension of the law of ballistics and adapted his expertise to the new age of technology. Yup, I'm stacking the deck.
2 Mar 1941 BB-55 engaged in rigorous training in gunnery and the use of her new search and fire control radars.
I know I'm fudging the dates to assure Bismarck and The showboat meet and still use as much of the OTL Bismarck's last cruise. I fear the RN's run of bad luck is about to get worse or maybe not?
Nice Senior Chief ( oscssw ), if i remember correctly, somebody on NavWeaps Forums (Naval Fiction) also tried to get get both SHOWBOAT verus the THE IRON CHANCELLOR, it was called the The Showboat Saga. Lordroel, my friend, I can honestly say this literary mess is original me.
I have no knowledge of " The Showboat Saga" or any other ATL dealing with BB-55 and Bismarck.
I am anxious to see where this leads. Bismarck and Prinze Eugene will still meet up with Hood and POW and the cruisres in the Denmark straight. The PBY will play an important role but. The "String Bags" and FAA will still be involved. Showboat's Curtis SOC Seagulls just might duel with one or more Arado Ar 196s. Enough said for now.  |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 27, 2022 17:38:46 GMT
Nice Senior Chief ( oscssw ), if i remember correctly, somebody on NavWeaps Forums (Naval Fiction) also tried to get get both SHOWBOAT verus the THE IRON CHANCELLOR, it was called the The Showboat Saga. Lordroel, my friend, I can honestly say this literary mess is original me.
Well sometimes two people can come up with the same original idea. |
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