gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 3, 2022 12:54:00 GMT
Philippines: Naval Battle of Manila BayOn arriving off the Philippine Island of Luzon on April 30, Dewey ordered a reconnaissance of Subic Bay by the Boston and Concord. After there were reports of gunfire coming from the direction of Subic Bay, Baltimore was sent to determine if the other ships had made contact. The reports were found to be in error and Spanish forces were not found in Subic Bay. On hearing the news, Dewey' commented to Commander Lamberton, his chief of staff, that "Now we have them!" The Asiatic Squadron's course was set for Manila Bay. In the meantime, Spanish Admiral Montojo received a telegram that evening notifying him that the Americans had reconnoitered Subic Bay, and had left, heading toward Manila Bay. Painting: the U.S. battle line turning while in action, with USS Olympia leading I heard the Imperial Germany Navy were also present in Manila Bay. They almost traded shots with the USN. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on May 3, 2022 15:02:50 GMT
Philippines: Naval Battle of Manila BayOn arriving off the Philippine Island of Luzon on April 30, Dewey ordered a reconnaissance of Subic Bay by the Boston and Concord. After there were reports of gunfire coming from the direction of Subic Bay, Baltimore was sent to determine if the other ships had made contact. The reports were found to be in error and Spanish forces were not found in Subic Bay. On hearing the news, Dewey' commented to Commander Lamberton, his chief of staff, that "Now we have them!" The Asiatic Squadron's course was set for Manila Bay. In the meantime, Spanish Admiral Montojo received a telegram that evening notifying him that the Americans had reconnoitered Subic Bay, and had left, heading toward Manila Bay. Painting: the U.S. battle line turning while in action, with USS Olympia leading I heard the Imperial Germany Navy were also present in Manila Bay. They almost traded shots with the USN. Yep, you will know more about than when the update comes related to it. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 3, 2022 16:13:59 GMT
I heard the Imperial Germany Navy were also present in Manila Bay. They almost traded shots with the USN. Yep, you will know more about than when the update comes related to it. One thing is certain, the appearance of the Imperial German fleet complicated things. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on May 3, 2022 16:18:37 GMT
Yep, you will know more about than when the update comes related to it. One thing is certain, the appearance of the Imperial German fleet complicated things. Yep, had Germany gone true with it, the Under the Iron Cross: What if Germany ruled the Philippines, the Philippines would be 16/17 years German and 30 years Japanese before being liberated by the Americans. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 3, 2022 16:19:33 GMT
WWI and WWII would be different here. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on May 3, 2022 16:20:25 GMT
WWI and WWII would be different here. At least you might now some German and Japanese gillan1220. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 3, 2022 16:30:57 GMT
WWI and WWII would be different here. At least you might now some German and Japanese gillan1220 . Also in this case, there won't be an "I Shall Return" moment. So the way Filipinos would see the Americans by the time the Philippines is invaded by the Allies in the alt-WWII would be vastly different. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on May 3, 2022 16:32:56 GMT
At least you might now some German and Japanese gillan1220 . Also in this case, there won't be an "I Shall Return" moment. So the way Filipinos would see the Americans by the time the Philippines is invaded by the Allies in the alt-WWII would be vastly different. Well the Philippines would still be a major price the Americans had to take in the war. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 3, 2022 16:52:11 GMT
Also in this case, there won't be an "I Shall Return" moment. So the way Filipinos would see the Americans by the time the Philippines is invaded by the Allies in the alt-WWII would be vastly different. Well the Philippines would still be a major price the Americans had to take in the war. It would be a series of unsinkable aircraft carriers that would point like a dagger towards the Japanese Empire. After Luzon is taken, the U.S. would probably go on island hopping into Taiwan and the Ryukyus before the equivalent of Downfall occurs here. |
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on May 4, 2022 0:08:29 GMT
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on May 4, 2022 12:23:33 GMT
Germany did not have resources to take over the Philippines at this period? |
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on May 4, 2022 19:13:05 GMT
Germany did not have resources to take over the Philippines at this period? The short answer is that Kaiser Wilhelm II thought he did, and so did his army. But the reality was that good in Europe on land, was not going to cut coconuts against the Filipinos at all or do butkus against the 1898 USN, either. The American army might have been an armed rabble in Cuba as Roosevelt declared, but the Illustrados on Luzon were hell in rope sandals, who would fix even that American army deficiency soon enough. The Germans were "clueless". |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on May 5, 2022 9:35:42 GMT
Germany did not have resources to take over the Philippines at this period? The short answer is that Kaiser Wilhelm II thought he did, and so did his army. But the reality was that good in Europe on land, was not going to cut coconuts against the Filipinos at all or do butkus against the 1898 USN, either. The American army might have been an armed rabble in Cuba as Roosevelt declared, but the Illustrados on Luzon were hell in rope sandals, who would fix even that American army deficiency soon enough. The Germans were "clueless".
I suggest you ask the Herero and Namaqua about that opinion of the German army. Their every bit as capable of being brutal as the US army was. Plus having a lot more troops and equipment. On the other hand they did seem to treat the natives well when the latter were obedient and they are more likely to treat Christian populations better so it might depend on who was the German governor of the islands and how they interacted with the locals. After all its unlikely that unlike German SW Africa the Philippines would be seen as suitable for large scale colonization. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on May 5, 2022 9:47:22 GMT
On today's WWI thread. a)
Typical cavalry, busy on the high priority task of chatting up the local women. 
b)
You have to wonder what he was smoking.  US money made a German victory in the west pretty much impossible despite continued cock-ups by Haig and Nivelle. |
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miletus12
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Post by miletus12 on May 5, 2022 9:59:30 GMT
I suggest you ask the Herero and Namaqua about that opinion of the German army. Their every bit as capable of being brutal as the US army was. Plus having a lot more troops and equipment. On the other hand they did seem to treat the natives well when the latter were obedient and they are more likely to treat Christian populations better so it might depend on who was the German governor of the islands and how they interacted with the locals. After all its unlikely that unlike German SW Africa the Philippines would be seen as suitable for large scale colonization. One should note that terrain, weather and access to arms and the defending local population capabilities are factors in my assessment of German chances. 1. The Germans have ZERO experience in amphibious warfare and small-scale warfare against tribes and well-organized national liberation movements. The Americans have recent jungle warfare and tropical warfare experience. 2. Brutal the Americans were, but they were canny, political and very adept at pitting local factions against each other. They also have a strong cavalry tradition in small scale wars and are MOUNTAIN FIGHTERS thanks to the Apache Wars. Namibia is a savannah type terrain with a temperate climate. It is rather dry. The local populace is not that well-armed and not at all well led or supplied or politically adept and they have no national liberation movement. The Philippine Republic... had an ARMY. It took 100,000 Americans six years to beat it. And to be honest, it was a campaign every bit as reprehensible and eerily similar to the Native American Wars. Maps>   |
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US money made a German victory in the west pretty much impossible despite continued cock-ups by Haig and Nivelle.