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Post by raharris1973 on Oct 10, 2024 12:32:27 GMT
What if Strongbow's invasion for Diarmit fails badly with him killed, leading to King Henry II not following after him.
More importantly, later attempts in the 1100s or 1200s to hire Anglo-Norman mercenaries, or independent Anglo-Norman invasion attempts, also fail. And England becomess increasingly absorbed in the Crusades, the Baron's Wars, and Angevin Empire affairs in France, with a side dish of Iberia, and less time or interest for Ireland.
The crowning distraction of course is the Hundred Years War starting in the 1300s.
And not long after that is done, we have the War of the Roses.
What is the not English-invaded-yet Ireland looking like at that point (1487) and what is the future looking like? Has any Irish-Scottish warring taken place, filling the vacuum?
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575
Captain
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Post by 575 on Oct 10, 2024 14:29:04 GMT
Looked up a Strongbow and then was lead to Maid of Norway and Robert Bruce and his sending his brother to Ireland and the Pope asking the English to enforce the Gregorian Reforms in Ireland. Thus all of the ingredients is around for somebody else to mess up Ireland if only relying on Papal consent - though if not the English then the Scots or somebody else with a Navy able to arrive in numbers in Ireland. Ireland could even end up the Battlefield of the West like Batics in the East with some Knights Order lodging somewhere on the island in a bridgehead close to Scotland/England for reinforcements of noblemen with retinue coming for papal absolution and some pillage and rapin! Another thing is what happens with Wales? Without the Marcher Barons to keep the squeeze on it will it be able to keep some sort of independence? Would really depend on how wooly stuffs going to play out. 1487: A divided Isle with a Norwegien Kingdom of the Isles in Ulster (and more in the Isles) - Scots Kingdom in Leinster and English in Munster with a local clan hanging on in Connaughts because no others really want to do the effort for the scrap! And really ripe for an English final go to clear up the mess!
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Oct 10, 2024 18:34:23 GMT
I think given its geological proximity and the nature of the Norman system with support for military expansion even if Strongbow failed there would be someone going along not too long afterwards. Some of the other events such as the Wars of the Roses are so distant they are unlikely to occur although other events could pop up.
Of course the nature of any such occupation and the possible presence of says Scots or Norwegian regions/influences which could make for an interesting different development.
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