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Post by justiniano on Sept 7, 2024 16:42:51 GMT
What if the Qing Dynasty didn't pursue isolationism? If instead, they decided to be different from the previous dynasty, claiming they lost the mandate of heaven because of isolationism. I mean foreign dynasties (which the Qing were) are usually open to foreign, culture, for eg. when it was under the Tang dynasty, it was China's big era of cosmopolitanism. The capital of xi'an had christian, muslim, persian and saudi populations just to name a couple. This was also when buddhism was introduced to china which is basically the last innovation you saw in chinese culture before the european colonization, buddhism filled a similar role to taoism and providing a release from the conformity of confucianism with monasteries to escape the stifling confusion, family and honoring social classes disliked under confucianism like the merchants and women as an overwhelmingly conservative society. This set the stage for other foreign and interventionist rulers of China to use Buddhism as China's state religion, like the Mongol Yuan dynasty. So, basically what I'm asking is, what if Qing China was more like Tang China, and less like Ming China? I personally think it would have avoided the century of humiliation, and possibly been the world's super power.
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Post by Max Sinister on Sept 7, 2024 20:32:37 GMT
Saudi? You mean Arab?
They were quite expansionist, at least for some time. The problem is: In the west, there's desert; in the north, Siberia; in the east, the Pacific Ocean; in the south, the Himalaya. Hard to cross either.
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Post by raharris1973 on Sept 7, 2024 21:13:21 GMT
Also questioning this- by Saudi did you mean Arab? Sunni Muslim? This was also when buddhism was introduced to china It was least a thousand years late, probably more, for the introduction of Buddhism. It had been around since at least the Tang and probably Sui dynasties. Trust me. Now as for you question, interventionist....expansionist. It was but it was physically and economically an militarily possible for it to have been more so, and that could have been very interesting. It also could have gone in several different cardinal directions by land or sea. It would have not been a "free lunch" - it would have cost lives, money, resources, but it also could have had rewards as well as risks and costs.
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Post by justiniano on Sept 8, 2024 0:26:07 GMT
Also questioning this- by Saudi did you mean Arab? Sunni Muslim? from what is today KSA. . It had been around since at least the Tang That's what I typed...
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Post by raharris1973 on Sept 8, 2024 13:55:19 GMT
. It had been around since at least the Tang That's what I typed... Indeed you did, I missed that you made an an extended comparison between the Tang and the Qing, as in, "what if the Qing were more like the Tang?" I stand corrected.
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Post by raharris1973 on Sept 8, 2024 14:47:48 GMT
justinianoOf potential interest to this idea - I made a composite map, showing what China's land borders would have looked like if the Qing Dynasty had made it a mission of their own to at least match the full extent of every previous Chinese dynasty in every geographic direction. The Qing were already, by the 1763-1791 timeframe, one of the largest, most extensive Chinese ruling dynasties, but there were still areas to their north or west outside their grasp that had earlier been under Yuan or Tang dominion, and areas to their south that had earlier been under Ming or Yuan Dominion. www.flickr.com/photos/22187058@N03/53980411330/in/dateposted/
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