lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Nov 22, 2020 10:10:41 GMT
Fokker D.XXIII, the last Netherlands pre-World War II fighter designThe Fokker D.XXIII was designed as a twin-engined single-seat aircraft. To overcome the problems of asymmetric flight it had a tractor engine at the front and a pusher engine at the rear. The D.XXIII was a cantilever monoplane with the twin tail units on booms. The pilot had an enclosed cockpit in between the tractor and pusher engines and it had a retractable tricycle landing gear. The prototype first flew on 30 May 1939 powered by two Walter Sagitta I-SR air cooled vee piston engines. The trial flights identified problems with the cooling of the rear engine and general engine performance. It was proposed to use Rolls-Royce or Daimler-Benz engines in the production aircraft. Concerns were also raised about the pilot clearing the rear propeller if he had to bail out and an ejector seat was studied. As a provisional solution, rails were put on both sides of the forward fuselage for the Fokker test pilot, Gerben Sonderman, to use to bail out in an emergency. The aircraft was flown 11 times for a total flight time of less than four hours. The rear fuselage paneling was modified significantly before the last few flights in an attempt to address chronic rear engine cooling problems. On the 11th flight in April, the undercarriage was damaged, and the programme was abandoned in May 1940 when the German forces invaded the Netherlands  A nice but short YouTube clip that was filmed in the Netherlands showing the Fokker D.XXIII prototype.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Nov 22, 2020 15:17:49 GMT
Interesting. Not sure why it was considered inferior - although bailing out would be a problem as you said - but I thought all the pusher designs had basically disappeared during or shortly after WWI so intriguing that the Netherlands were still considering it as an option here. Also the idea of both a pusher and a puller in the same fuselage does enable two engines on a smaller frame but I wonder if there was turbulence problems with the airflow from the front prop possibly adversely affecting the rear one?
The design looks a bit like the US P-38_Lightning which had the same truncated main body and twin wings linking back up to a combined tail but it had its two engines in a more conventional either side of the fuselage on the main wing body. Would have been interesting to see how the Fokker D.XXIII might have developed without the German invasion.
What if any connection was there between the Dutch Fokker company and its German counterpart?
Steve
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Nov 22, 2020 15:33:06 GMT
Interesting. Not sure why it was considered inferior - although bailing out would be a problem as you said
It would definitely be a problem, even if Fokker mange to design and build a ejector seat. But still a nice looking plane, it reminds me of the Kyushu J7W Shinden, minus the frontal propeller.  |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Nov 22, 2020 16:15:44 GMT
Interesting. Not sure why it was considered inferior - although bailing out would be a problem as you said
It would definitely be a problem, even if Fokker mange to design and build a ejector seat. But still a nice looking plane, it reminds me of the Kyushu J7W Shinden, minus the frontal propeller.
That looks rather cramped and also with two engines in those locations - which means the front one is being fed by pipes going past the cockpit from a tank just behind the pilot's position there might also be a greater fire risk than in a P-38 type design where I think the fuel storage was in the wings, which also allowed markedly longer range. [Which probably wouldn't be an issue for the Netherlands itself but might be rather attractive for operations in the DEI.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Nov 22, 2020 16:23:18 GMT
It would definitely be a problem, even if Fokker mange to design and build a ejector seat. But still a nice looking plane, it reminds me of the Kyushu J7W Shinden, minus the frontal propeller. That looks rather cramped and also with two engines in those locations - which means the front one is being fed by pipes going past the cockpit from a tank just behind the pilot's position there might also be a greater fire risk than in a P-38 type design where I think the fuel storage was in the wings, which also allowed markedly longer range. [Which probably wouldn't be an issue for the Netherlands itself but might be rather attractive for operations in the DEI.
Think the Fokker D.XXIII would be a good companion to the Fokker G.I. But i do not know if the Royal Netherlands East Indies Army Air Force would be interesting in the Fokker D.XXIII, by 1940 they operated the Brewster F2A Buffalo and had ordered the Hawk 75A-7. |
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1bigrich
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Post by 1bigrich on Nov 22, 2020 21:21:57 GMT
If I recall correctly, ejection seats were developed because of aircraft with pusher propellers. The Donier Do-335 comes to mind as one example with an ejection seat....
Regards,
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Nov 23, 2020 15:47:58 GMT
If I recall correctly, ejection seats were developed because of aircraft with pusher propellers. The Donier Do-335 comes to mind as one example with an ejection seat.... Regards,
Interesting, thanks. I wasn't aware of the German work which was before that by Martin-Baker which I had heard of before - triggered by one of its founders, James Martin being killed in a crash in 1942, although checking their wiki entry they were looking at some sort of system back in 1934.
Steve
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Nov 23, 2020 15:49:26 GMT
If I recall correctly, ejection seats were developed because of aircraft with pusher propellers. The Donier Do-335 comes to mind as one example with an ejection seat.... Regards, Interesting, thanks. I wasn't aware of the German work which was before that by Martin-Baker which I had heard of before - triggered by one of its founders, James Martin being killed in a crash in 1942, although checking their wiki entry they were looking at some sort of system back in 1934. Steve
Doubt the Netherlands with their budget could design a working ejector seat. |
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