James G
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Post by James G on Feb 1, 2019 9:38:56 GMT
By what point in the future can we expect to see the last human armies?
Robotic war machines continue to show growth and casualty averse governments continue. Surely at some point we reach the time when there are no more soldiers?
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 1, 2019 11:14:47 GMT
By what point in the future can we expect to see the last human armies? Robotic war machines continue to show growth and casualty averse governments continue. Surely at some point we reach the time when there are no more soldiers?
Unlikely unless we see the last humans. Either the AI machines never gain total capacity to operate on their own, either because we can't develop it or decide not to risk it, or if they do and their supply chain is also automated that could be a dangerous position.
Also the desire to avoid any human losses is only really strong in the west plus we have seen periods before when after very bitter fighting nations have sought to minimise battle [and civilian] losses but sooner or later some change in warfare or society prompts new large scale bloodshed. Plus even a successful but controlled fully automated military would still raise questions about guerilla war and internal unrest. If you also robotise the police and internal security what prevents dictators gaining control and suppressing all opposition?
Another factor, if you have a largely/totally robot military which isn't totally self-aware, what's the danger of someone hacking the controls?
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 1, 2019 11:16:52 GMT
Another factor, if you have a largely/totally robot military which isn't totally self-aware, what's the danger of someone hacking the controls?
Ore going Terminator. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 1, 2019 11:31:06 GMT
Another factor, if you have a largely/totally robot military which isn't totally self-aware, what's the danger of someone hacking the controls?
Ore going Terminator.
That's a problem, either because of a malicious hack or a self-aware system that decides it doesn't want to fight other robots for human 'masters'.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 11:47:58 GMT
When combat is fully automated, human beings can only perform two roles:
1. Hapless victim.
2. Innocent bystander
If only machines are at stake, there is no incentive to surrender for either combatant, unless the robot conflict is merely a prelude to mass casualty attacks on defenceless population centers.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 1, 2019 16:02:21 GMT
When combat is fully automated, human beings can only perform two roles: 1. Hapless victim. 2. Innocent bystander If only machines are at stake, there is no incentive to surrender for either combatant, unless the robot conflict is merely a prelude to mass casualty attacks on defenceless population centers.
Very good point. What happens when one set of robots gets past its opponents and reaches the 'enemy' heartland? If they don't do at least material damage there is no pressure to concede and it would be very easy for that damage to wander into human casualties.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 7, 2019 17:49:03 GMT
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James G
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Post by James G on Feb 13, 2019 20:29:28 GMT
I have this imagine of the last human soldiers being Foot Guards units and such like.
Of course, comments above show this as rather unlikely, but that would be how I imagine a last human army.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Feb 15, 2019 21:46:49 GMT
An AI arms race makes for a damned terrifying hypothetical, don't get me wrong. But given what sort of government the PRC is, it'd also be risky to let China become the top dog in such a decisive and transformational technological field. But since the thread isn't in Politics and Current Affairs, I'll leave this aspect of the issue at that. To address the actual question here, I'm inclined to agree that humans will at least retain a supervisory role over any large-scale AI forces that get employed in the future. The prospect of a robot takeover is just too perilous to be complacent about, and this already done-to-death trope is likely so ingrained in pop culture that it won't be forgotten anytime soon. And that's all without factoring in the reasonable assumption that "AI Natives" will grow up conscientious of such a possibility(s), seeing as they'd be living alongside robots on a 24/7 basis. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 15, 2019 21:53:25 GMT
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Feb 16, 2019 0:34:05 GMT
This was a thought-piquing opinion piece; it brought up more than a few moral, philosophical and policy concerns that need be factored into the equation when it comes to AI advancement. The technological terminology makes it hard to for me to fully understand, but I think I get the gist of what Ms. Pandya intends to communicate. A century-ahead repeat of the industrialized conflict that marked World War I is nothing to look forward to. So please, whatever powers may be, please don't let the Terminator franchise be anything more than sci-fi. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 16, 2019 9:21:25 GMT
This was a thought-piquing opinion piece; it brought up more than a few moral, philosophical and policy concerns that need be factored into the equation when it comes to AI advancement. The technological terminology makes it hard to for me to fully understand, but I think I get the gist of what Ms. Pandya intends to communicate. A century-ahead repeat of the industrialized conflict that marked World War I is nothing to look forward to. So please, whatever powers may be, please don't let the Terminator franchise be anything more than sci-fi. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 16, 2019 12:15:57 GMT
This was a thought-piquing opinion piece; it brought up more than a few moral, philosophical and policy concerns that need be factored into the equation when it comes to AI advancement. The technological terminology makes it hard to for me to fully understand, but I think I get the gist of what Ms. Pandya intends to communicate. A century-ahead repeat of the industrialized conflict that marked World War I is nothing to look forward to. So please, whatever powers may be, please don't let the Terminator franchise be anything more than sci-fi.
That could be the problem in the longer term presuming that AI actually proves possible. One option might be to fully accept such AI as people and citizens and hence seek to win their loyalty. Would be risky but possibly no less than seeking to maintain control by some other factors which could cause the sort of alienation and hostility that would be dangerous. Can you keep something that intelligent eternally imprisoned?
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 16, 2019 12:24:22 GMT
This was a thought-piquing opinion piece; it brought up more than a few moral, philosophical and policy concerns that need be factored into the equation when it comes to AI advancement. The technological terminology makes it hard to for me to fully understand, but I think I get the gist of what Ms. Pandya intends to communicate. A century-ahead repeat of the industrialized conflict that marked World War I is nothing to look forward to. So please, whatever powers may be, please don't let the Terminator franchise be anything more than sci-fi. That could be the problem in the longer term presuming that AI actually proves possible. One option might be to fully accept such AI as people and citizens and hence seek to win their loyalty. Would be risky but possibly no less than seeking to maintain control by some other factors which could cause the sort of alienation and hostility that would be dangerous. Can you keep something that intelligent eternally imprisoned?
Not if whe keep making the AI smarter in the future. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 16, 2019 12:51:53 GMT
That could be the problem in the longer term presuming that AI actually proves possible. One option might be to fully accept such AI as people and citizens and hence seek to win their loyalty. Would be risky but possibly no less than seeking to maintain control by some other factors which could cause the sort of alienation and hostility that would be dangerous. Can you keep something that intelligent eternally imprisoned?
Not if whe keep making the AI smarter in the future.
Which we would really need to do if we thought rivals/potential opponents were also doing the same.
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