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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Aug 18, 2018 4:26:37 GMT
The Safavids were historically the ones who have created the first Persian empire since the Sassanian era, defeating the Aq Qoyunlu, who have been in decline. They proceeded to consolidate control over the rest of Iran, and would last for a while until they collapsed in 1736.
So what if they failed to conquer Iran? Where could the Safavids go if conquering Iran becomes too difficult? Would they go for the rest of the Caucasus, the Middle East, or would they try to court the Alevis who were menacing the Ottoman Empire's eastern border? In the absence of the Safavids, which other group would have a better chance of conquering Iran?
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Aug 18, 2018 6:00:28 GMT
The Safavids were historically the ones who have created the first Persian empire since the Sassanian era, defeating the Aq Qoyunlu, who have been in decline. They proceeded to consolidate control over the rest of Iran, and would last for a while until they collapsed in 1736. So what if they failed to conquer Iran? Where could the Safavids go if conquering Iran becomes too difficult? Would they go for the rest of the Caucasus, the Middle East, or would they try to court the Alevis who were menacing the Ottoman Empire's eastern border? In the absence of the Safavids, which other group would have a better chance of conquering Iran? You mean this dynasty, it looks like they can go into Turkey ore Arabia.  |
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Aug 18, 2018 6:06:25 GMT
Yep, that dynasty.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Aug 18, 2018 6:17:51 GMT
Would that mean that the Safavids will go into conflict with the Ottomans. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Aug 18, 2018 11:17:18 GMT
Would that mean that the Safavids will go into conflict with the Ottomans.
Well they did anyway and all the alternative options TRS suggests are on the Ottoman eastern border or within it so I think that's pretty certain if they become a major power in Iran or elsewhere. Also from the wiki entry, see Safavid_dynasty, they started in the Azerbaijan region, of mixed Azerbaijan and Kurdish origin so their likely to run into the Ottomans even if they become nothing more than a small regional power. Especially considering their Shia beliefs. [If they don't rule Iran and convert it to Shiasm that would be a huge butterfly.
One alternative, given their origins, is possibly they emerge as a predominantly Kurdish force, possibly establishing an empire based around the Kurdish lands. This could struggle to survive however as it would be caught between Turks, the Mamluks [if not conquered by the Turks before the Safavids emerge] and possibly any state emerging in Iran or southern Mesopotamia. However a Kurdish state, possibly with support from parts of Azerbaijan, Circassia and possibly some of the Georgian and Armenian lands it could be a formidable entity. Albeit its emerging so late its facing the Ottomans pretty much at their height and so close to their core territories its going to be bloody difficult for them to succeed, unless some serious disaster comes up for the Ottomans.
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Aug 19, 2018 0:09:27 GMT
One factor that will be at play here is that the Safavids would have brought the Alevis on their side, as they were revolting against the Ottomans. In addition, the Qizilbash would certainly be playing a bigger role here. In the absence of Safavid Persia, the next strongest power to conquer them would be the Shaybanids, a Genghisid offshoot who controls Central Asia. In the early days of OTL Safavids, they went to war with the Shaybanid Uzbeks.
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