mullauna
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Post by mullauna on Mar 4, 2018 5:13:03 GMT
I wonder what would happen if a past country - say Wilhelmine Germany or Tsarist Russia were teleported to the present. How would their populations react to lefty modern activists trying to dismantle - for example - the laws and customs in the empires that favour religion and where the people viewed atheism very direly?
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Post by lukedalton on Mar 4, 2018 5:42:59 GMT
If this happen lefty modern activist will be the last and minor problem that the new arrived and the rest of the world will face; better also remember that the nation you have nominated were not shining example of democracy (Russia in primis but also Imperial Germany) so the great part of the world will try to stabilize the situation and bring some more democracy in that land. The local population will be more enthralled by Internet and widespread use of electricity than what you call lefty modern activist
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Mar 4, 2018 14:41:33 GMT
There would be huge cultural and economic shocks on both sides, especially with a state as large and prominent in their time [or now] as those two examples. For all the benefits that modern technology could offer I could see a lot of people in either of those states drawing closer to their traditional system as a source of security in a very frightening and unstable world. Not saying everybody in those states would reject the modern world as many would be drawn to its potential but you could see a lot of resistance to many modern ideas and facilities.
One other complication with those two states is that their precursors to two of the nastiest regimes of the 20thC, Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia, which could mean some hunting down of people who were later significant in those regimes in OTL and probably some soul-searching. Which leads to the question of how do you treat someone from 1914 say who later in OTL became a mass-murdering monster? I suspect the answer would be different if your asking people from the down-time region or the modern world.
On the up-time side there would be huge uphevels, especially economically but also politically. The re-appearance of Czarist Russia would mean the disappearence of Putin's state, along with much of current central Asia, areas of eastern Europe and Finland for instance. There would be no nuclear threat from it but an huge power vacuum and how assorted players, most noticeably the US, China and assorted people in the ME respond? Also your likely to have potential disease problems as smallpox could well be back in the world and many others far more prevalent.
With imperial Germany you would largely gut much of the EU and Britexit would become a minor problem in comparison. Not only modern Germany but a large slice of modern Poland would be lost as well as small but significant parts of Russia and France and smaller areas of Denmark and Belgium. [Presuming that the German overseas empire doesm't come across which would add further problems]. Its not just the regions replaced by somewhere from 1914 [say] but the fact that communications inside the rest if the EU are disrupted and also questions of ownership of assets in much of the world with the disappearance of modern Germany and neighbouring areas. Also modern day Germans outside the affected area are either stateless or are they citizens of 1914 imperial Germany? [Other affected people do have their 'home' country in part to come back to but will also have problems.]
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2018 18:05:05 GMT
How would their populations react to lefty modern activists trying to dismantle - for example - the laws and customs in the empires Which lefty activists do you mean - the US government, IMF, WTO, EU, UN, UNICEF, UNESCO, NATO? All would appear to be interfering activists to the downtimers. The local population will be more enthralled by Internet and widespread use of electricity They will have to travel to an uptimer country to experience this, however.
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Post by lukedalton on Mar 4, 2018 18:40:04 GMT
The local population will be more enthralled by Internet and widespread use of electricity They will have to travel to an uptimer country to experience this, however. Sure, but i expect that at least in the big city of the new arrived, there will be a massive presence of people for the various international relief organization that news and phisical example of this will quickly become widespread
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2018 18:43:44 GMT
Sure, but i expect that at least in the big city of the new arrived, there will be a massive presence of people for the various international relief organization that news and phisical example of this will quickly become widespread I think they will more terrified of the ships and helicopters they arrive in. There will be no 4G, Wifi or Broadboard infrastructure in place
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mullauna
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Post by mullauna on Mar 4, 2018 19:12:02 GMT
Nicholas II's daughters will be surprised and appalled by what modern pop culture has done to them ('stasia in particular).
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Mar 4, 2018 20:22:51 GMT
You would destroy Europe economic moter, it going to be worst then a 1,000 Brexits if Wilhelmine Germany appeared in 2018, also Poland will not be happy/
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mullauna
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Post by mullauna on Mar 5, 2018 6:42:52 GMT
If Nicholas II's Russian Empire appeared, most of the peasant population thinks collective ownership of farming is their salvation, so a bunch of Americans coming to force the free market on them... well, sit back with a big bowl of popcorn!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2018 10:13:55 GMT
Wilhelmine Germany appeared in 2018, also Poland will not be happy/ Poland would invade, and capture Berlin most probably, the mood it's in. The Russians would not be happy, either. They would have lost Kaliningrad.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Mar 5, 2018 15:46:04 GMT
Wilhelmine Germany appeared in 2018, also Poland will not be happy/ Poland would invade, and capture Berlin most probably, the mood it's in. The Russians would not be happy, either. They would have lost Kaliningrad. Would the Poles want ~10-15M or more German speaking people, especially if they had the task of administrating them and bringing them up to present day standards? Not to mention the mistrust of the rest of the German population and of their former EU colleagues. I think Russia is more likely to be a problem here as despite the fact the land in question is pretty much totally German in population I can't see Putin being happy with losing any territory, or prestige since he's tied himself to hard line ultra-nationalism.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Mar 5, 2018 15:48:12 GMT
Poland would invade, and capture Berlin most probably, the mood it's in. The Russians would not be happy, either. They would have lost Kaliningrad. Would the Poles want ~10-15M or more German speaking people, especially if they had the task of administrating them and bringing them up to present day standards? Not to mention the mistrust of the rest of the German population and of their former EU colleagues. I think Russia is more likely to be a problem here as despite the fact the land in question is pretty much totally German in population I can't see Putin being happy with losing any territory, or prestige since he's tied himself to hard line ultra-nationalism. But to get to Wilhelmine Germany who controls Kaliningrad the Russian either have to go true Poland ore do a amphibious assault.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Mar 5, 2018 15:50:34 GMT
Here is a map that shows Modern European borders superimposed over Europe in 1914 immediately before World War 1.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Mar 5, 2018 15:58:39 GMT
Would the Poles want ~10-15M or more German speaking people, especially if they had the task of administrating them and bringing them up to present day standards? Not to mention the mistrust of the rest of the German population and of their former EU colleagues. I think Russia is more likely to be a problem here as despite the fact the land in question is pretty much totally German in population I can't see Putin being happy with losing any territory, or prestige since he's tied himself to hard line ultra-nationalism. But to get to Wilhelmine Germany who controls Kaliningrad the Russian either have to go true Poland ore do a amphibious assault. They could probably do an amphibious assault, at least unless NATO was quickly to come to Germany's defence, in which case things could get very nasty. Also possibly use paras to help in any invasion while modern a/c in just about any role would be a huge shock to the imperial Germans. I think the big issue is how quickly people realise what has happened and IF the west decides to establish what would be basically a protectorate over imperial Germany.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Mar 5, 2018 15:59:49 GMT
But to get to Wilhelmine Germany who controls Kaliningrad the Russian either have to go true Poland ore do a amphibious assault. They could probably do an amphibious assault, at least unless NATO was quickly to come to Germany's defence, in which case things could get very nasty. Also possibly use paras to help in any invasion while modern a/c in just about any role would be a huge shock to the imperial Germans. I think the big issue is how quickly people realise what has happened and IF the west decides to establish what would be basically a protectorate over imperial Germany. Russia might want to offer Poland some help, if Poland takes it.
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