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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Dec 14, 2021 1:28:55 GMT
How could England be in a realistic position to acquire the Burgundian Inheritance? If anything, Mary of Burgundy being matched to an English prince would have resulted in both France and the HRE becoming hostile towards them.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 14, 2021 14:34:21 GMT
How could England be in a realistic position to acquire the Burgundian Inheritance? If anything, Mary of Burgundy being matched to an English prince would have resulted in both France and the HRE becoming hostile towards them.
I would definitely agree here. Think that TheRomanSlayer, is thinking of the alliance between the Plantagenet and house of Burgundy in Henry V's time becoming something closer. Possibly for some reason Henry V lives longer - in which case France would probably be part [the majority of] of the Plantagenet lands although in that case the Burgundians may be weary of such a connection. Or that OTL post-Agincourt agreement over Henry's marriage to the French queen's daughter doesn't occur. In that case he and the Burgundians could have ended up fighting France longer, possibly not conquering it completely but see the need to become closer allies to keep it from being a threat. |
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oscssw
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Post by oscssw on Feb 16, 2022 16:35:27 GMT
Burgundy because I like a good Pinot noir and why shouldn't our UK friends be denied the same pleasure?  Burgundy and Scottish whiskey, they will rule the world. Dam you got me again Senior Chief, i am so sorry regarding me, you and the mention of strong drinks. According to the Bible my friend; you are wise.
Proverbs 20:1
"Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise."
No one has ever accused me of that. Maybe because I drink?  |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Feb 16, 2022 16:38:04 GMT
Burgundy and Scottish whiskey, they will rule the world. Dam you got me again Senior Chief, i am so sorry regarding me, you and the mention of strong drinks. According to the Bible my friend; you are wise.
Proverbs 20:1
"Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise."
No one has ever accused me of that. Maybe because I drink? Then drink for me as well Senior Chief, unless it is shot of Ouzo when i am eating in a Greek restaurant. |
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oscssw
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Post by oscssw on Feb 16, 2022 17:34:42 GMT
According to the Bible my friend; you are wise.
Proverbs 20:1
"Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise."
No one has ever accused me of that. Maybe because I drink? Then drink for me as well Senior Chief, unless it is shot of Ouzo when i am eating in a Greek restaurant. If you limit your drinking, my friend, Ouzo is not a bad choice. Ouzo is an anisette-flavored liqueur. To me it tastes a lot like black licorice. I don't use it myself but I do like the taste of anisette ... In cigars.
One of my very favorite foul weather cigars is an anisette infused Avanti Continental cheroot. Stays lit in high wind, salt spray and even moderate rain. It is derived from the famous "Parodi" that my Maternal grand father chain smoked underway. Now he was "Some kind of sailor man." I miss him every single day.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2022 13:22:42 GMT
The OTL personal union between England and Scotland is the safest bet if you ask me.
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Feb 18, 2022 21:38:43 GMT
The OTL personal union between England and Scotland is the safest bet if you ask me. True, and it happened with Scotland getting lucky that England had no Tudors left in the direct male line. |
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Post by halferking on Feb 19, 2022 0:29:25 GMT
The Third Act of Succession 1543 recognised Prince Edward and his as heirs and restored the Lady Mary and the Lady Elizabeth to the Line of Succession. In 1546 Henry made a Will that not only cemented the Line of Succession as established by the 1543 Act, but excluded the descendants of Margaret, his older sister, in favour of the descendants of Mary, his younger sister.
The Lady Mary, daughter of Henry VIII and Catherine of Aragon, was a devote Roman Catholic and her ascendancy to the Throne of England cast an ominous cloud over the Kingdom. Her younger half-brother King Edward VI sought to exclude his half-sister’s claim and relied upon his late Father’s Will and therefore proclaimed Lady Jane Grey, his first cousin once removed and great-grand-daughter of Henry VII and grand-daughter of Mary Tudor, as his successor. In OTL “Queen” Mary raised an army and forced the 17-year-old Queen Jane and her Husband Lord Guilford Dudley from the Throne.
Queen Mary I in taking the Crown had set in motion a chain of events that would lead to the Personal Union of the Crowns on the death of her half-Sister Queen Elizabeth I in 1603.
I wonder had Mary died before being triumphant then perhaps the Lady Jane Grey would be able to press her claim to the Throne of England, as the rightful heir of King Edward VI, and thus the Throne would pass from the House of Tudor to the House of Grey preventing the union of the Kingdom of Scotland and the Kingdom of England.
A personal union, if any, would then depend on who the male heirs of Queen Jane married...
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Feb 19, 2022 22:45:16 GMT
I guess the Anglo-Scottish Union is easily the most achievable, because it would unite the entire British Isles, but an Anglo-Burgundian Union would be a merchant's utopia, because they mainly focused on economic trades and such. Plus we could call it the Wine Union, mainly because the UK and Burgundy would possess ample supplies of wine.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 20, 2022 18:30:46 GMT
I guess the Anglo-Scottish Union is easily the most achievable, because it would unite the entire British Isles, but an Anglo-Burgundian Union would be a merchant's utopia, because they mainly focused on economic trades and such. Plus we could call it the Wine Union, mainly because the UK and Burgundy would possess ample supplies of wine.
Although it might upset the Portuguese, as their port exports could be hit hard. |
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Apr 3, 2022 3:18:57 GMT
Wow, so Burgundy easily wins the title of England's best junior partner. Although an Anglo-Dutch union might also have a similar level of mercantile trading power as the Anglo-Burgundian Union, it wouldn't be as powerful, but makes up for it with colonial ventures.
The way I see it, the Anglo-Burgundian union would also benefit Burgundy in the long run, as its geographic position would allow them to channel much of their trade between the English Channel and the Italian Peninsula, if Burgundy shares a border with any Italian entity. Ironically, it might be Burgundy that eventually becomes the Hypercompetent Sidekick in the union, keeping the union with England and at the same time playing a game with the rest of the Holy Roman Empire.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Apr 3, 2022 17:10:12 GMT
Wow, so Burgundy easily wins the title of England's best junior partner. Although an Anglo-Dutch union might also have a similar level of mercantile trading power as the Anglo-Burgundian Union, it wouldn't be as powerful, but makes up for it with colonial ventures. The way I see it, the Anglo-Burgundian union would also benefit Burgundy in the long run, as its geographic position would allow them to channel much of their trade between the English Channel and the Italian Peninsula, if Burgundy shares a border with any Italian entity. Ironically, it might be Burgundy that eventually becomes the Hypercompetent Sidekick in the union, keeping the union with England and at the same time playing a game with the rest of the Holy Roman Empire.
Definitely if the House of Burgundy can keep the lands that Charles the Bold had and include Lorraine and latter gains in what's now the northern Netherlands its going to be a major powerhouse economically provided that: a) It doesn't suffer very bad government
and more seriously possibly b) Its power and position doesn't make it too high on too many hit lists, especially by France and the HRE but possibly by others. Even if their unsuccessful in defeating it and annexing a lot of lands wars are very expensive and also maintaining large armies to deter or defend your lands. Like the Netherland during and after the wars with Louis XIV it could become too strained by the continued conflicts, both economically and socially.
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