stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 21, 2017 23:14:45 GMT
There is another thing to consider. If we assume its a straight swap then our Canada and a good chunk of the US has been transferred into the world the KoC has come from. Which will be a shock to all.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 22, 2017 10:33:03 GMT
There is another thing to consider. If we assume its a straight swap then our Canada and a good chunk of the US has been transferred into the world the KoC has come from. Which will be a shock to all. Also includes this Canada from our universe.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 22, 2017 18:42:18 GMT
There is another thing to consider. If we assume its a straight swap then our Canada and a good chunk of the US has been transferred into the world the KoC has come from. Which will be a shock to all. Also includes this Canada from our universe. Yes which will be a shock both to them and to the British empire, which has lost its most powerful member. Especially since our Canada may well not want to slot into the KoC's place, i.e. being a full member of the imperial parliament. However it will be even more chaotic to the south. Two different America's long with a markedly more powerful Mexico and the New England Confederation and the Kingdom of Georgia. [The latter includes the OTL US states of S Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Alabama, Mississippi and the Mississippi delta, as well as the British Caribbean colonie, which in this world include Cuba]. Furthermore since it is a full member of the imperial parliament and majority black its going to be a surprise to everybody from our world.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 22, 2017 18:59:31 GMT
Also includes this Canada from our universe. Yes which will be a shock both to them and to the British empire, which has lost its most powerful member. Especially since our Canada may well not want to slot into the KoC's place, i.e. being a full member of the imperial parliament. However it will be even more chaotic to the south. Two different America's long with a markedly more powerful Mexico and the New England Confederation and the Kingdom of Georgia. [The latter includes the OTL US states of S Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Alabama, Mississippi and the Mississippi delta, as well as the British Caribbean colonie, which in this world include Cuba]. Furthermore since it is a full member of the imperial parliament and majority black its going to be a surprise to everybody from our world. Going back to the KoC, if they in peace time have 12 divisions i can see them send one ore two to the United Kingdom as a start, i do wonder what the OTL Canadian Army (consisting of the 1st Canadian Division) will do that is station already in the United Kingdom, they just saw their country being replace by a mega-Canada.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 22, 2017 23:05:40 GMT
Yes which will be a shock both to them and to the British empire, which has lost its most powerful member. Especially since our Canada may well not want to slot into the KoC's place, i.e. being a full member of the imperial parliament. However it will be even more chaotic to the south. Two different America's long with a markedly more powerful Mexico and the New England Confederation and the Kingdom of Georgia. [The latter includes the OTL US states of S Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Alabama, Mississippi and the Mississippi delta, as well as the British Caribbean colonie, which in this world include Cuba]. Furthermore since it is a full member of the imperial parliament and majority black its going to be a surprise to everybody from our world. Going back to the KoC, if they in peace time have 12 divisions i can see them send one ore two to the United Kingdom as a start, i do wonder what the OTL Canadian Army (consisting of the 1st Canadian Division) will do that is station already in the United Kingdom, they just saw their country being replace by a mega-Canada. That's going to be a problem for a lot of displaced people. Especially prehaps those who have lost their families as a result. I suspect the 1st Canadian div will stay as a unit working within the British army during the war but afterwards its people will have to decide what to do. Some might go 'back' to Canada, with some of them fitting in while others find it a bit too alien - in part because elements are clearly Canadian and end up moving elsewhere. Others could well end up in Britain, especially if they become attached to British girls during their service, or elsewhere in the empire. For the KoC it will be very willing to help but could be constrained by relations with the US. Given their US is their traditional enemy/threat, albeit not that realistic for several generations, this US is a hell of a lot bigger and also there could be some tensions over the disapperance of so much American lands and citizens. It might actually be 1st some naval and air units going east. After all the big threat is either invasion or air bombardment, with a silice of blockade going in. The big and fast BBs the KoC can supply could be very unseful in closing the GIUK gap against raiders, although not sure they would have radar? Some escorts would also be useful for protecting convoys, although again not quite sure about technology levels when it comes to ASW. Plus of course there are bound to be differences in equipment standards, doctrine and the like so it would take some sorting out 1st. Not sure in terms of naval support against big raiders whether KoC BBs and supporting vessels or the small 'British' squadron would be politically the least awkward, especially if the latter left one of its flying officers in KoC.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 23, 2017 3:27:36 GMT
Not sure in terms of naval support against big raiders whether KoC BBs and supporting vessels or the small 'British' squadron would be politically the least awkward, especially if the latter left one of its flying officers in KoC. Would that small 'British' squadron answer only to the highest British authority that is present in the KoC instead of OTL British admiralty, if not than the KoC can argue that it is the only one that can command that squadron as both come from the same place.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 23, 2017 17:22:13 GMT
Not sure in terms of naval support against big raiders whether KoC BBs and supporting vessels or the small 'British' squadron would be politically the least awkward, especially if the latter left one of its flying officers in KoC. Would that small 'British' squadron answer only to the highest British authority that is present in the KoC instead of OTL British admiralty, if not than the KoC can argue that it is the only one that can command that squadron as both come from the same place. Good point. Think they would identify with Canada anyway as that's part of the imperial federation their familiar with, even without the presence of a member of their royal family. Our Britain is somewhat alien to them, possibly even more so because in many ways it would be very similar but with slight differences in assorted ways. [With a POD nearly 160 years back there are bound to be some changes even if the broad sweep of events are in many ways similar.] However that unit, with or without the prince/emperor would probably be politically the easiest unit to transfer for initial aid. Mind you the OTL RN will be rather jealous when they see HMS Temeraire and HMS Bellerophon, 46,500 tons, 9x16" guns, 29kts. Still they would be an even greater shock to any German raiders that run into them.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 23, 2017 19:51:44 GMT
Would that small 'British' squadron answer only to the highest British authority that is present in the KoC instead of OTL British admiralty, if not than the KoC can argue that it is the only one that can command that squadron as both come from the same place. However that unit, with or without the prince/emperor would probably be politically the easiest unit to transfer for initial aid. Mind you the OTL RN will be rather jealous when they see HMS Temeraire and HMS Bellerophon, 46,500 tons, 9x16" guns, 29kts. Still they would be an even greater shock to any German raiders that run into them. This universe might need this big guns, the United States Navy has been dealt a very big blow with the appearance of the KoC.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 23, 2017 23:20:03 GMT
However that unit, with or without the prince/emperor would probably be politically the easiest unit to transfer for initial aid. Mind you the OTL RN will be rather jealous when they see HMS Temeraire and HMS Bellerophon, 46,500 tons, 9x16" guns, 29kts. Still they would be an even greater shock to any German raiders that run into them. This universe might need this big guns, the United States Navy has been dealt a very big blow with the appearance of the KoC. Very true. The KoC makes up for it to a degree but they probably don't have the same level of expertise in carrier warfare. Which could be a problem. Plus that they would have to foreward base to Pearl which could be awkward. Unless they go all the way to Singapore with their Pacific fleet. Just had a nasty thought in terms of whether the KoC big ships could fit through the Panama canal, which could be a problem.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 24, 2017 9:06:11 GMT
This universe might need this big guns, the United States Navy has been dealt a very big blow with the appearance of the KoC. Just had a nasty thought in terms of whether the KoC big ships could fit through the Panama canal, which could be a problem. They do have other smaller ships like submarines they can send in advance ahead of the big guns.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 24, 2017 12:25:25 GMT
Just had a nasty thought in terms of whether the KoC big ships could fit through the Panama canal, which could be a problem. They do have other smaller ships like submarines they can send in advance ahead of the big guns. Very true and of course the primary British need would probably be escort vessels for the convoys, although KoC ships escorting convoys into New York could be a bit awkward for a while. Mind you they could just escort them to Halifax and also once things such as standards get sorted out this Canada has a bloody big industrial base so it could largely replace the US for most items, oil possibly being an exception.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 24, 2017 12:27:15 GMT
They do have other smaller ships like submarines they can send in advance ahead of the big guns. Very true and of course the primary British need would probably be escort vessels for the convoys, although KoC ships escorting convoys into New York could be a bit awkward for a while. Mind you they could just escort them to Halifax and also once things such as standards get sorted out this Canada has a bloody big industrial base so it could largely replace the US for most items, oil possibly being an exception. I would assume that one ore two of those 12 division the Royal Canadian Army has are armored ore is it mostly a infantry force.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 24, 2017 12:58:47 GMT
Very true and of course the primary British need would probably be escort vessels for the convoys, although KoC ships escorting convoys into New York could be a bit awkward for a while. Mind you they could just escort them to Halifax and also once things such as standards get sorted out this Canada has a bloody big industrial base so it could largely replace the US for most items, oil possibly being an exception. I would assume that one ore two of those 12 division the Royal Canadian Army has are armored ore is it mostly a infantry force. Good point. I simply haven't thought of that. Suspect given the circumstances there would be at least an experimental armoured division, although since the last big war ended in 1909 there might not be the same push for motorised units. However given that dragged on because of the problems forcing Russia to make peace and the size of a potential war in N America there might be an incentive there. Our Britain was already converting to a fully motorised army before the war so probably at the least a lot of the regular units would be motorised and there are likely to be some form of tanks. Of course how standard equipment and doctrines and the like would be between the KoC and its new allies could be awkward. Simply a slightly different standard screw size could foul up a lot of interaction.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Dec 24, 2017 13:11:43 GMT
I would assume that one ore two of those 12 division the Royal Canadian Army has are armored ore is it mostly a infantry force. Good point. I simply haven't thought of that. Suspect given the circumstances there would be at least an experimental armoured division, although since the last big war ended in 1909 there might not be the same push for motorised units. However given that dragged on because of the problems forcing Russia to make peace and the size of a potential war in N America there might be an incentive there. Our Britain was already converting to a fully motorised army before the war so probably at the least a lot of the regular units would be motorised and there are likely to be some form of tanks. Of course how standard equipment and doctrines and the like would be between the KoC and its new allies could be awkward. Simply a slightly different standard screw size could foul up a lot of interaction.
Then this site i used for another thread you created on this forum might help: canadiansoldiers.com
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Dec 24, 2017 16:01:36 GMT
Good point. I simply haven't thought of that. Suspect given the circumstances there would be at least an experimental armoured division, although since the last big war ended in 1909 there might not be the same push for motorised units. However given that dragged on because of the problems forcing Russia to make peace and the size of a potential war in N America there might be an incentive there. Our Britain was already converting to a fully motorised army before the war so probably at the least a lot of the regular units would be motorised and there are likely to be some form of tanks. Of course how standard equipment and doctrines and the like would be between the KoC and its new allies could be awkward. Simply a slightly different standard screw size could foul up a lot of interaction.
Then this site i used for another thread you created on this forum might help: canadiansoldiers.com
Could be useful but don't forget this is a much larger Canada starting from a point ~160 years back so a hell of a lot could well be different.
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